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Boragirl03

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
I need some advice/help. I was running the Haltech F5 with two additional 440cc injectors along with the stock injectors on my MK4 2.0L. I figured that was too much fuel, so I swapped one of the 440's out for a 310. I know still a lot of fuel, but getting better. Oh...this is actually for the 2002+ 2.0T owners or anyone who knows a lot about that car. When I am WOT my CE light starts flashing and the car bogs. I haven't scanned it yet, but I bet a get a code that concerns the MAF.
I know the 2.0 and the VR6 have the same sensor, just different housing, my question is if the MAF...well not shuts down, but goes into some sort of default mode when it sees too much air passing thru?
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Only because if the VR6 and 2.0L use the same sensor...it has to be in the housing size or the signal to the ECU that allows the VR6 to flow more air without sending codes. Did I lose you guys or are you still with me????
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Thanks any help is appreciated.
 
Discussion starter · #3 ·
Re: knowledgeable dubbers... (ced)

I know, I had a misfire in cyl 4....i have it set at 8psi...but the weird thing is the ce light doesn't start to flash until the EPC light comes on, which is related to the MAF, so I think it is wiggin because it is seeing to much air passing thru. I could be wrong tho.
 
#7 ·
Re: knowledgeable dubbers... (Boragirl03)

Isn't that Haltech unit adjustable? Meaning, just back off the fuel or whatever?
2kjettaguy has done a lot "reasearch" on the MK4 2.0L so he should be able to clear up that MAF stuff.
But basically, running a larger housing means that the same amount of air moves through a larger space, so identical sensors will give different readings only by changing the housing. But the chip has to be programmed to "know" this.
As much as you'll hate to hear this, without putting a wideband on the car, you have no idea where your fuel is. Evan is pushing 10 psi with just fuel enrichement, so 8 psi should be easy, so long as your Haltech is programmed (or adjusted?) properly!
Hope that helps!
 
#8 ·
Re: knowledgeable dubbers... (Agtronic)

1.8T's have MAP and MAF sensor,so you can run it (1.8T) with MAF unplugged no problem(sometimes runs better like that!!),but the 2.0 and VR cars will not run with MAF unplugged...................
 
#9 ·
Re: knowledgeable dubbers... (Holy Piston)

If your getting a "signal too high" code, your check engine light will stay on.
generally.
When you get this code the car throws itself into a stored fuel pattern that will be rich, but not usually rich enough. You could be getting mis fires from running to rich up top with the addition of the added injectors.
The MAf signal to high or to low codes stay in your ECU you should be able to check that at your local autozone, or with vag com if you have it.
If that is the case, you will need either a piggyback system (split second) so you can lessen voltage going to the ECU while opening the injectors at the correct rate for the adjusted voltage or as AGtronic stated a chip that knows the bigger housing is in place. Other wise you will run lean. The bigger housing allows the sensor to see less air, (simply speaking) but there is still the same amount of air going through it. If your chip doesnt know that 2 Volts actually equals 3 then it will not open the injectors long enough.
 
#10 ·
Re: knowledgeable dubbers... (mattstacks)

swap up to a larger housing...
for 310's use a stock vr6 size ~2.75" ID.
be careful as this will advance the timing some.
Same effect as running a VAFC type piggy back, with one MAJOR
exception, the MAF can actually measure more flow.
Jeffrey Atwood
 
Discussion starter · #11 ·
Re: knowledgeable dubbers... (Jefnes3)

I appreciate everyone's input. For those that suggested adjusting the Haltech there is one problem...with the slightest turn of the knob to lean it out a bit, it falls all the way to the lean side and visa versa. The unit is too sensitive (tyrolkid tried to tune it) So I was thinking about downgrading the additional injectors so they would flow less fuel. In hopes of the car running leaner, but not too lean. It is running rich to the point where you can smell it. When I go to work tomorrow I will scan the car and get the readings..hopefully one of the guys in the shop can clear the codes because I don't think I am aloowed to.
 
Discussion starter · #12 ·
Re: knowledgeable dubbers... (Boragirl03)

mattstacks....that is what seems to be happening. At WOT when the injectors are fully flowing is when I get the misfires. And I know I am definately running rich up top. Tyrolkid unplugged one of the injectors and it ran much better, but he thought it was a little too lean, so I figure the additional 880cc's was too much, the single 440cc might not be enough, so 620ccs (the 2 310's) should be ok.
 
Discussion starter · #15 ·
Re: knowledgeable dubbers... (Boragirl03)

Got my car scanned today at my job...WOW. Wanna know the results??
O2 Senosr Heater Circ., Bank1-Sensor2
Malfunction
sporadic DTC
O2 Sensor Heater Circ., Bank1-Sensor2
Open
sporadic DTC
Mass or Vloume Air Flow Circ.
Short B+
sporadic DTC
Random/Multiple Cylinder
Misfire Detected
Cyl. 4
Misfire Detected
Cyl. 1
Misfire Detected
sporadic DTC
Zyl. 1, ignition circuit
open
sporadic DTC
Zyl. 4 ignition cirucuit
open
sporadic DTC
Sec.Air Inj. Sys.
Incorrect Flow Detected
Cyl. 2
Misfire Detected
sporadic DTC
Cyl. 3
Misfire Detected
sporadic DTC
O2 Sensor Circ. Bank1-Sensor2
Slow Response
Zyl. 3 iginition circuit
open
sporadic DTC
A lot of codes huh? Well we cleared them out, dropped one 440cc injector for a 310cc and the car seems to run better, didn't misfire and hey...my CEL is off. Hasn't been off in like 5 months
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#16 ·
Re: knowledgeable dubbers... (Boragirl03)

the right thing to do would to get stand alone!
but... noone ever does that.
so you can use those injectors jsut get a fuel pressure regulator and turn it down.
also you should invest in a 1.8t mass air sensor if you not going to get satnd alone that should make it run smoother. most of those codes you are getting are o2 codes and misfires.
on mk4's the o2 senor monitors AF ratio that is why you are getting the o2 codes your air fuel ratio is off. and if your ratio is off then come the misfires. well hope i can help ya http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
is it just me guys or do we all wonder if bora girl is a cutie???
 
Discussion starter · #17 ·
Re: knowledgeable dubbers... (Tommy K)

Tommy K....I just laughed so hard at the end of your post....that was too cute. Well to answer that I guess you can ask a few of the guys I have met, you may get mixed votes, you may not...lol.
But it funny that you mentioned the 1.8T MAF, they told me to get one when I was at work. I guess I'll have to snag one off of the other cars and try it.
I want standalone sooo bad...but my bank account won't let me have it.
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Modified by Boragirl03 at 5:00 PM 2-8-2004
 
Discussion starter · #18 ·
Re: knowledgeable dubbers... (Boragirl03)

I was just thinking...I gave my bro a aeromotive fpr which he doesn't use, however isn't the stock fpr rated lower the 30 psi? if so then why should i switch? the stock would still flow less.
 
#19 ·
Im willin to bet all the excess fuel you are pissing in there is confusing the hell out of the ECU. It keeps trying to pull fuel, then until it cant pull no more yet the car is still rich so it throws the code.
You're car has factory wideband right? If so, thats probably why its saying its a heater circuit. The factory widebands that VW uses are unlike the older 1,2, 3, 4 wire units that simply use the heater to heat the sensor to operating temp. Wideband O2s actually use the heater circuit to measure the o2 level, and the temp is highly regulated. If you have way way way too high EGTs it will cause the sensor all sorts of problems as the sensor gets hotter than the ECU wants it.
If your car is factory turbo get some MUCH smaller injectors. Hell, 2 310cc injectors are good for 120-140hp easily. If you have to run two injectors I would go down to about half that.
 
Discussion starter · #20 ·
Re: (BoostedOne)

now my car isn't factory turbo, the 2.0 never made one. The car is running rich, which is the problem. I have a total of 6 injectors. I might have to drop the other 440 injector for a 310.
 
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Boragirl03
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