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Discussion starter · #581 ·
Can anyone explain what work is needed to use a 2.0 fsi block and bottom end. It seems like would be a cheap option that could hold more power then stock 9a stuff but cost less then buying forged pistons and rods.
Do not use the 06F (2.0 FSI) block. It will cost you more to get the required conversion bits than it would to use a 2.0 8V or even a 1.8T (bored out to 82.5mm bore).

06A block requires:
- Head studs
- head gasket

06F block requires:
- Oil filter housing adapter plate
- Oil pump conversion
unless you want to roll the dice with the stock 06F oil pump.
 
I've been thinking about doing this hybrid conversion with my 16V Gti for a while now. A few years ago I had to put a new engine in after breaking the timing belt on the original engine. I still have that old motor and head with the bent valves and have dreamed about rebuilding that, but after seeing this thread have thought this might be a better solution.

The question I have now is should I swap out the original 020 5 speed that is there for a different one? I was wondering if there was a better transmission to put in if/when I eventually do this? I have had all sorts of shifting problems, even after replacing all the worn bushings with delrin ones. I also have a really tight clutch with no real play or adjustment in the cable ever since I replaced my clutch when putting in that new engine. What I experienced as shifting issues ended up being issues with the clutch not disengaging enough. Any advice as I make these plans would be great.
 
Does it shift OK now?

If you are still having shifting problems, they could be caused by bad or maladjusted motor mounts.

I know the Scirocco 16V used a different right motor mount than the 8V. I don't know about the GTI 16V.

Bad or maladjusted motor mounts also affect other VWs that use the 020.

A dealer once pressed the transmission side mount in upside down on my Scirocco 8V and I could not get the shifter aligned.

I took it back apart and compared the mounts to the Bentley. I took the transmission mount back to the dealer to get it pressed in rightside up.

EDIT: I plumb forgot the GTI 16V was a MK2. Golly!
 
02A is popular upgrade. I did a swap thread here:

The process is nearly the same for Mk2, except you can opt to keep a cable clutch with a Eurovan kit, or go hydraulic with Corrado parts.

The motor mounts on MK2 are all the same, fit-wise, even between the different designs of the front and passenger side mounts (early were disc shaped, later were cup shaped). The trans mount on Mk2 and Mk3 are all identically swappable, some are hydro and some are rubber, but that's it.
 
Sooooo I've only gotten to about page 10 and have this question, might be a stupid one but only if it remains unasked. Can I use my 88 16v scirocco head and my 2000 tt225 block to create a Scirocco 16v225t? Can I use the tt engine management or do I need to go standalone?
 
I also just wanted to say thanks to everyone that posted in this thread. I have a Mk2 16V and a Rocco 16V. My Rocco was bought after sitting with a blown headgasket and one or two of the cylinders is trash. A few years ago I found a wrecking yard that had two 9A engines for $120 each, so I bought them. One for the Rocco, another for a Mk1 Rabbit I had at the time I was going to convert to carb'd, cammed 16V.
As for my Mk2, I am simply DONE with owning cars without A/C! I live in Florida. And the V belt setup sucks @$$.. On the Mk2 I did a ton of work converting it to ABA stuff like 3 years ago, never quite finished because it seemed like I went from one problem/interference to another. I put these cars off to the side while I worked on some other projects and life.

I love the packaging of the Mk4 4 cylinder engines. I have swapped an AEG into a Mk1 like 7 or 8 years ago(in my sig). But I wanted to keep both of these cars 16V on CIS. I have a Euro K-basic CIS setup for both of them.

For the past year I told myself I am going to get both of these cars going again. Again, A/C is a must. Id ponder how I would do some kind of custom serpentine setup from time to time.

Then like 6 months ago I was sitting in the shop and it popped in my head that the AEG is a short deck and 2, and the Mk4/PL/9A are similar in head bolt pattern, I knew the Mk4 used a wide belt.. I went "Hmmm, I wonder if I could hybrid the 16V head on an AEG??" Popped on google to look for differences I might have missed and this thread came right up..

For some this swap makes zero sense. For others it makes perfect sense. I havent seen an ABA in the junkyard in years. And if you want air conditioning without retightening the V belt every 500 miles, the ABA brackets dont fit the older cars very well.

One thing I will add, is now the U-Pull-Its are getting very proud of their stuff. LKQ is up $279+75 core for a long block(not including the accessories), and $179+45 core for a short block. So youre looking at $225-$350 plus a day scorching in the wrecking yard for a 200K mile Mk4 engine.

So I went on Ebay and started looking at the Mk6 2.0 Engines. Since they made a ton of them, theres a huge supply, and since they dont break, theres no demand for them. Sure enough, apparently there full service wrecking yards full of them, with no buyers. LKQ in particular has a ton of them all over the country. I bought two complete CPBA code engines, one is from a 2014 that cost me $170, and one from a 2011 that cost me $130. No core, no spending all day in the U Pull it. From what I can find and see, its basically just a slightly more modern version of the BEV/AZH/AEG.

The accessory bracket for the CPBA is different than the Mk4, but thats in part because the Mk6 AC compressor bolts on different. I thought about using the Mk6 compressor, but it has funky ports, and the adaptors ports are easily available. So I went to the junkyard and pulled the accessory bracket, alternator and PS pump of a 2004 Golf, and it fit the CPBA just fine. Just need to make sure you get the bolts with the bracket, because the CPBA bracket bolts are longer than the Mk4 bolts.

Looking forward to picking up another engine stand or two so I can start checking out the internals, but I am expecting the Mk6 CPBA will be just like a Mk4 2.0 internally.
 
I also just wanted to say thanks to everyone that posted in this thread. I have a Mk2 16V and a Rocco 16V. My Rocco was bought after sitting with a blown headgasket and one or two of the cylinders is trash. A few years ago I found a wrecking yard that had two 9A engines for $120 each, so I bought them. One for the Rocco, another for a Mk1 Rabbit I had at the time I was going to convert to carb'd, cammed 16V.
As for my Mk2, I am simply DONE with owning cars without A/C! I live in Florida. And the V belt setup sucks @$$.. On the Mk2 I did a ton of work converting it to ABA stuff like 3 years ago, never quite finished because it seemed like I went from one problem/interference to another. I put these cars off to the side while I worked on some other projects and life.

I love the packaging of the Mk4 4 cylinder engines. I have swapped an AEG into a Mk1 like 7 or 8 years ago(in my sig). But I wanted to keep both of these cars 16V on CIS. I have a Euro K-basic CIS setup for both of them.

For the past year I told myself I am going to get both of these cars going again. Again, A/C is a must. Id ponder how I would do some kind of custom serpentine setup from time to time.

Then like 6 months ago I was sitting in the shop and it popped in my head that the AEG is a short deck and 2, and the Mk4/PL/9A are similar in head bolt pattern, I knew the Mk4 used a wide belt.. I went "Hmmm, I wonder if I could hybrid the 16V head on an AEG??" Popped on google to look for differences I might have missed and this thread came right up..

For some this swap makes zero sense. For others it makes perfect sense. I havent seen an ABA in the junkyard in years. And if you want air conditioning without retightening the V belt every 500 miles, the ABA brackets dont fit the older cars very well.

One thing I will add, is now the U-Pull-Its are getting very proud of their stuff. LKQ is up $279+75 core for a long block(not including the accessories), and $179+45 core for a short block. So youre looking at $225-$350 plus a day scorching in the wrecking yard for a 200K mile Mk4 engine.

So I went on Ebay and started looking at the Mk6 2.0 Engines. Since they made a ton of them, theres a huge supply, and since they dont break, theres no demand for them. Sure enough, apparently there full service wrecking yards full of them, with no buyers. LKQ in particular has a ton of them all over the country. I bought two complete CPBA code engines, one is from a 2014 that cost me $170, and one from a 2011 that cost me $130. No core, no spending all day in the U Pull it. From what I can find and see, its basically just a slightly more modern version of the BEV/AZH/AEG.

The accessory bracket for the CPBA is different than the Mk4, but thats in part because the Mk6 AC compressor bolts on different. I thought about using the Mk6 compressor, but it has funky ports, and the adaptors ports are easily available. So I went to the junkyard and pulled the accessory bracket, alternator and PS pump of a 2004 Golf, and it fit the CPBA just fine. Just need to make sure you get the bolts with the bracket, because the CPBA bracket bolts are longer than the Mk4 bolts.

Looking forward to picking up another engine stand or two so I can start checking out the internals, but I am expecting the Mk6 CPBA will be just like a Mk4 2.0 internally.
Very interesting.
Can you get 16V pistons for them?
 
They would use the same ones as a Mk4 which are the same as a 9A uses. Their rods are probably 19 mm so either open them to 20 mm or use 9A rods.
Yep, basically. Decided to post my story, see below.

So, its been about 4 months, and the car has been running for about three weeks!
This was a very budget build. But I am glad I did it.
So as mentioned, I bought my Rocco January 14,2016, according to the time stamp on the picture.
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I bought it from a guy who bought it from Copart with no history. Running the Carfax showed it last registered in 2002.
After replacing the fuel pumps and putting new fuel in it, I found out on the reason it was sitting for so long.
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I replaced the head gasket, but found a couple of cylinders rusty as hell. Tried to clean it up, but it ran rough as crap.

So the car sat until this fall. As mentioned, in August I picked up a 2.0 from a 2011 Jetta Mk6.
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Since the engine didnt have any accessories(alternator, PS Pump, etc) I grabbed those from a I went to the U Pull It and pulled everything except the AC Compressor(will buy that new) from a Mk4. If you do this be sure to get the bolts for the bracket, as they are a different length than the bolts for the Mk6 bracket.
This is a junk spare 16V head I threw on just to check fitup of the mk4 accessories.
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From there I began tearing down one of the 9A engines I purchased to install in the car a few years ago so I could get the rods/pistons. This is why I say I am glad I went this route..
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I could have sworn I took pics of the internals. The pistons managed to clean up pretty good, amazingly. I weighed all the pistons and rods, and found all the rods to be within a gram or so, and the pistons to be within 7 grams. I then determined where the material had to be removed from the pistons to clear the oil squirters, crank counterweights, and tone ring. I performed the notching of the pistons by hand with a steady hand on a die grinder. I ground the pistons to the same weight variance as the rods, and ultimately had rods and pistons all within a gram.

For bearings I noticed the ring specs for the 16V and the Mk4 and Mk6 were the same. So I ended up using Mk4 or Mk6 rings and Mk6 bearings. The ring choice was mainly due to availability of Mahle rings at a good price. I assume the Mk4 and 6 rings are a low tension ring that is common on most newer vehicles.

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So at this point I pulled the engine out of the car so I could get my PL head, and start getting the trans cleaned up and ready for the reinstall.

Headbolts/headstuds. I debated the options of McMaster 10mm bolts, ARP studs, and redrilling the block to 11mm. I decided to drill and tap for 11mm. Ordered a standard and bottoming tap, only to find the block has counterbore on the head bolt holes. I dont know if this is a Mk6 thing, but the first 10-13mm of the head bolt holes in the block are not threaded, and were basically about the size of the 11mm head bolt. Therefore, if I was to drill and tap for 11mm I would have lost a LOT of thread engagement.
So I ended up going the McMaster route for now, as I am not boosting it and just want the car to be able to move at this point. Keep in mind that in almost 6 years of ownership, I have driven it maybe 5 miles. Its been pushed around and collecting dust the rest of the time. The head was just refreshed when I did the head gasket 5 miles ago, so all I did to the head was to transfer the new dowel hole location and install a set of Schrick 260 cams I had laying around.

On December 2, it was all finally bolted together! One thing I didnt think about was the front water neck, and the port that used to go to the old water pump. Not shown in this pic, but I pulled it back off, and noticed that the ID was about the drill size for a 3/4" NPT. So I cut the nipple down, tapped it for 3/4" NPT, and installed a pipe plug to block off the lower port.
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After that, I got to thinking about the crank case ventilation thing. One thing thats different on the Mk6 vs the Mk4, is if you look closely at the 2nd to last pic, that while the feature is cast into the housing for the PCV pipe(that gets plugged on the Mk4 2.0), on the Mk6 its not open. I noticed this early on, but Issam mentioned along the way at some point that welding a nipple to the valve cover is an option. The more I thought about it, the less I liked that idea.
I decided to try some hack isht. I removed the housing from the engine, and drilled out the port to make it functional. I then obtained a 304 stainless 1" NPT to 1.25" barb 90 off Amazon. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07M76JVLP?ref=ppx_yo2_dt_b_product_details&th=1. Now for the hack isht. I have Ultra Black RTV in the pressurized can. I put the adaptor in the vice to hold it steady. I then put a thick layer of Ultra Black on the bore of the port, then inserted the elbow at the desired angle. I then filled the gap between the elbow and the housing solid with RTV and let it set for 24 hours to cure. I can tell you, its never coming out! And the original hose fits perfect.
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So from there, it was get the trans cleaned up for install, and all the rest of that jazz. On December 11th, had first fire and and ran!! Put the engine and trans back in the car, made up some custom AC lines, and on December 14th, got to do this! Its so awesome turning the AC on and not hearing a belt squeel! LOL
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For oil coolant hoses, I happened to have a couple sets of new oil cooler hoses laying around for the ALH. The one that goes to the water pipe installs as normal. But on the Mk4/Mk6, the nipple for the other hose is on the bottom of the water neck, and on the 16V its on the top of the neck. Not sure about the others, but the ALH hose had enough length to twist it and rotate it to the top side nipple location.
Upper radiator hose is standard 16V.
Lower radiator hose is standard 16V, cut in front of the AC compressor where its running parallel to the radiator. Then two Dayco 70641 hoses joined by a 1.25" hose joiner.
Power steering pump is Mk4, with Mk3 high pressure hose, factory return hose.

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And out for its first ride running good in probably almost 20 years!!
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Great job! Pictures of a 06A/9A on a stand in front of a mk4 jetta wagon sure does bring back memories.

I’d like more details on the custom AC lines. Did you DIY or had them made?
 
I made my own A/C lines on my project and if anyone ever does, they really need to look into the reduced barrier hoses. They are so much smaller in outer diameter and way more flexible than the standard hose.

Making hoses is fairly easy. Get the cheap Chinese hose crimping tool and once you have the fittings/hoses, it's a piece of cake.
 
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