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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
i would describe it as if driving a manual car and reving high in 2nd gear and then shifting into 4th... skipping 3rd gear. thats how it feels but it doesnt actually skip any gears, it still goes through all 5 gears but the problem only occurs when going from 2nd to 3rd gear. Any thoughts on what might be causing the problem since its only effecting one shift....shifting for every other gear is fine, except from 2nd to 3rd.

i scanned it with ross-tech and got a 00652 which states the following:

00652 - Gear Monitoring: Implausible Signal
Possible Causes
Automatic Transmission Fluid (ATF) Level not OK
Vehicle Speed Sensor (G68) dirty/faulty
Impulse Wheel dirty or Installation faulty
Gearbox Speed Sensor (G38) dirty/faulty
Impulse Wheel dirty or Installation faulty
Multi-Function Switch (F125) faulty (but not detected)
Clutch or Valve Body faulty
Automatic Transmission Fluid (ATF) Pump faulty
Possible Solutions
Check Automatic Transmission Fluid (ATF) Level
Check/Clean/Replace Vehicle Speed Sensor (G68)
Check/Clean/Replace Gearbox Speed Sensor (G38)
Check/Replace Multi-Function Switch (F125)
Check/Replace Clutch and/or Valve Body
Special Notes
The ratio of engine speed to gearbox output speed in the currently engaged gear is implausible.
Slip rpm with torque converter lock-up clutch disengaged must be greater than stall speed.

thanks
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
it might be worth mentioning the rest of the codes i pulled off the car... ive read that some people with more severe cases were caused by a faulty tcm, since there are other electrical problems maybe a short in the car may have damaged the tcm?

Chassis Type: 1J - VW G/J/B Mk4
Scan: 01,02,03,08,16,15,17,19,22,35,46,56

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine
Controller: 06A 906 032 LQ
Component: 1.8L R4/5VT G 0007
Coding: 07550

1 Fault Found:
18032 - MIL Request Signal Active (Check TCM for errors too!)
P1624 - 35-00 - -
Readiness: 0000 0000


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 02: Auto Trans
Controller: 09A 927 750 BD
Component: AG5 Getriebe 09A 0237

1 Fault Found:
00652 - Gear Monitoring
27-10 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes
Controller: 1C0 907 379 M
Component: ESP FRONT MK60 0102
Coding: 0019970

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Skipping Address 15-Airbags

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments
Controller: 1J0 920 906 N
Component: KOMBI+WEGFAHRSP VDO V65
Coding: 07234

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway
Controller: 6N0 909 901
Component: Gateway KCAN 0001
Coding: 00006

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 46: Central Conv.
Controller: 1C0 959 799 C
Component: 1H Komfortger·t HLO 0003
Coding: 00258

1 Fault Found:
01358 - Internal Central Locking Switch: Driver Side (E150)
27-10 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 56: Radio
Controller: 3B7 035 180 E
Component: RADIO 3CP 0004
Coding: 05035

2 Faults Found:
01317 - Control Module in Instrument Cluster (J285)
49-00 - No Communications
00858 - Connection: Radio ZF Output to Antenna Amplifier
36-00 - Open Circuit


End --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 

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I've never experienced your problem specifically, but those soleonoids have alot of issues.

read through the 09A threads in the FAQ section of the auto trans section.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
but im not getting any solenoid codes. and its not so much an issue of the ability to mechanically shift gears so much as its a matter of 'when' to shift, shifting at the right time.

another thing ive noticed is that i should be able to check the atf temp with vag-com, but when i open that measuring block it says error. only block 003 works, 002,004,005 do not work.

can you tell me where the tcm is located, i want to try a swap before i take a crack at the trans itself.

thanks man.
 

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but im not getting any solenoid codes. and its not so much an issue of the ability to mechanically shift gears so much as its a matter of 'when' to shift, shifting at the right time.

another thing ive noticed is that i should be able to check the atf temp with vag-com, but when i open that measuring block it says error. only block 003 works, 002,004,005 do not work.

can you tell me where the tcm is located, i want to try a swap before i take a crack at the trans itself.

thanks man.
On the Mk 4, the TCM is in the plenum behind the engine, remove the rain tray to get to it. It's in the middle of the car, next to the fresh air filter box.

My uneducated guess as to what is happening: N88 solenoid is sticking. Check the FAQ, thread "09A Tiptronic Solenoid Location & Function". There you will see that de-energizing N88 is the only shift solenoid change for a 2-3 upshift. So, TCM de-energizes N88 at the right time, and as far as the TCM is concerned, you are now in 3rd gear. But if the solenoid sticks, the shift won't be made. Now the TCM notices that engine RPMs are high for 3rd gear (and they are high ... because the tranny has not shifted yet), and the TCM reports the mismatch engine RPM vs final drive RPM as "implausible signal".

A solenoid that sticks (mechanically) won't throw a code by itself ... to get a solenoid code it has to be an electrical problem, either the coil draws too much current (a short circuit) or not enough (an open circuit).

There is a great DIY for changing 09A solenoid(s) in the same FAQ section. Worked great for me. I would try that before changing the TCM, but maybe some more experienced AT guys can weigh in. Also, check here:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5261552-02-Gti-won-t-engage-3rd-gear-when-warm and here:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?4642216-Replacing-Selonid-N88-N92-ver.-2.0&highlight=n88
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
Dude Charlie thanks so much man, i have been reading a lot of info on the 09a... been researching heavily for about a week now. when i scanned and the code came back as atf fluid level or speed sensor as the top culprit i was skeptical. i definitely have this feeling that if it were something like that there would be more symptoms, ie. affecting more than just the 2-3 shift point. i thought might as well try the tcm hope i get lucky and avoid having to open the trans, again i think a faulty tcm would cause major problems. but what you're saying makes much more sense. i just read the other two threads you mentioned and i feel more confident now that it is in fact a solenoid issue. by the way, our car has ~110k on it.


--Do you have recommendations on where to buy the solenoid set? how much were they when you bought them and is mitsubishi the only manufacture? how long did the job take?

--What block would give me the fluid temp? thats still something i havent been able to see. I get the speed, load%, gear, another load% from 003 but cant figure out how to see the temp.

Thanks again man, if you happen to be located in so cal let me know!
 

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--Do you have recommendations on where to buy the solenoid set? how much were they when you bought them and is mitsubishi the only manufacture? how long did the job take?
I got mine from www.cobratransmission.com, but www.makcotransmissionparts.com had them too, $350-$370 for the set of nine I think. Yes, mine were OEM mitsubishi, just like what came out.

--What block would give me the fluid temp? thats still something i havent been able to see. I get the speed, load%, gear, another load% from 003 but cant figure out how to see the temp.
Sorry, can't help here. I checked mine and it was working, but I don't know the block. I think there is a place in VAG-COM where you can look for monitoring data by name, rather than block, but I'm not at that computer and I don't recall the details.

May be block #2, according to this thread: http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?1093467
 

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I had entire remanufactured valve body put on at local shop bc i had the 3rd to fourth issue with n89 getting stuck and it would then shift to 1st then slam hard into third. So i test drove the car a minute ago and now when shifting to third it revs up and then goes into gear. Or you can anticipate the change and let off gas and give it two seconds and it then shifts to third and drives fine after. Could this be a faulty valve body even though its new. I really am at a loss. They said they can do the other half of the rebuild (clutches n stuff) for another 1250. Im about to leave to pay the first 1250. So if this could be a bad valve body and you think i should tell my mechanic that plz answer me now. Plz!!!! I had to get a loan just to get this accomished. I desperately need some advice
 

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I'm sorry your in this situation.

There is a chance that your VB is defective and there is also a chance that the internals of the trans have a problem as well. I guess your just gonna have to trust the guys opinion who is working on it.
 

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there is a lot of good advice here, you have more than enough information to start fixing your transmission.
In my opinion, I would start with the TCM and then the solenoids.
My issues started just like yours, at the end, when trying to figure out why transmission failed I saw that TCM was not feeding voltage to one of the solenoids, so from the very beggining, when transmission started acting up, I could have just changed the TCM and problems would have been fixed, instead of spending a lot of money on the rebuild, which became necessary due to keep using my car in that condition (burned clutch packs).
If your car has had this condition for a long time, I would suspect a burned high clutch.
 

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I think the problem is related to your 00652 "gear monitoring" error message. Here's a link to the rosstech wiki page on the subject: http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/00652

An excerpt:
Possible Causes

Automatic Transmission Fluid (ATF) Level not OK
Vehicle Speed Sensor (G68) dirty/faulty
Impulse Wheel dirty or Installation faulty
Gearbox Speed Sensor (G38) dirty/faulty
Impulse Wheel dirty or Installation faulty
Multi-Function Switch (F125) faulty (but not detected)
Clutch or Valve Body faulty
Automatic Transmission Fluid (ATF) Pump faulty

It suggests that the problem could be a lack of signal from the G68 sensor (among other things). I'd suggest pulling the plug on the ECM and ohming out the G68, which should be the same as the other two sensors (I forget off-hand if it's supposed to be 300 or 600 ohms). The good news is that you can buy a new sensor relatively cheaply. The bad news is that replacing it requires dropping and splitting the transmission (I had to do this to replace an open G265 intermediate shaft speed sensor). But at least this is one thing you should be able to check fairly definitively with a meter (if it's open, it's bad).

With the VagCom utility, you can chart the output of the three separate speed sensors in the transmission. I'd seriously recommend finding this screen and driving around to see what kind of signals you're getting - I'm betting the problem will become a lot more obvious.
 
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