[Coastal CC 3.6]

Introducing myself and looking for any information surrounding the 3.6 (2014 version) HPFP Timing issues.

Recently purchased a used 2014 CC 3.6 4Motion, mileage when purchased was 70K, been doing some what I consider to be preventive maintenance, to it to the local VW dealer for the 4Motion fluid and filter change, added brake fluid and oil+filter change upon recommendation, picked the car up and now have P0088 code tripped on dash, plugged in my Snapon Solice Edge and did a reset but it returns consistently, looking into it and I am seeing that the HPFP could jump timing wch will cause the code I am getting, anybody here seen this?

PS, I did a search and did not find anything so excuse me if there is a thread on this topic.

Regards,

Bruce

 

[OEMplusCC]

Some resources for you

P0088 - Ross-Tech Wiki

wiki.ross-tech.com

which links to this

https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2020/MC-10180093-0001.pdf

 

[mellofello9]

How many miles on the car now and how's it running with that code present? Is that the only code you have?

Also, the HPFP is driven by a cam follower so not sure it can "jump time" in a traditional sense, unless I am misunderstanding what you mean.

 

[OEMplusCC]

How many miles on the car now and how's it running with that code present? Is that the only code you have?

Also, the HPFP is driven by a cam follower so not sure it can "jump time" in a traditional sense, unless I am misunderstanding what you mean.

Yeah I was wondering about the same. But after I read the TSB I linked above. It look like this code is just a byproduct of stretched chain. Chain stretches more than 8 degrees which makes the cam follower to be either 8degrees "to early" or "too late" to compress on the HPFP. That then sets of "pressure to high" for that given instance of time.

 

[Coastal CC 3.6]

How many miles on the car now and how's it running with that code present? Is that the only code you have?

Also, the HPFP is driven by a cam follower so not sure it can "jump time" in a traditional sense, unless I am misunderstanding what you mean.

76K

 

[Coastal CC 3.6]

Jumps time is perhaps the wrong verbiage but it is what a mechanic posted on a youtube video, in the video it showed a failed chain tensioner which allowed the HPFP to deviate timing and cause the fuel pressure in my case to be in excess of 1800 Bar, the answer to how it runs, smooth under normal driving but if you lean into it, about 4500 rpm it stumbles and will not upshift.

 

[Coastal CC 3.6]

This is one of a few I have found and compared to my issue, identical.

My question was to see if anyone had different findings before I pull either the engine or the trans to replace all of the timing chain and associated hardware on a car with 76K and a complete maintenance history, I am finding it a little hard to believe the chain wear as a factor.

Since this post was started,
I have pulled the valve cover and the chain and top chain guide are very clean and I see virtually no wear on the nylon guide.

 

[Coastal CC 3.6]

Forgot to add this

 

[Coastal CC 3.6]

76K

Update!

After some disassembly I found the Cam chain to be loose, this allowed the HPFP drive to have significant play, during timing alignment I heard a click and immediately all play in the cam chain and HPFP was gone, it looks like the chain tensioner somehow got stuck, I will be replacing it and re-assembling the engine, I will report back if the P0088 code goes away and stays gone.

If this is the correct diagnoses, it may save some folks a little time and work. In this engine with only 76K I was skeptical about excessive chain wear (stretch) and wondered why the tensioner did not compensate.

 

[OEMplusCC]

Update!

After some disassembly I found the Cam chain to be loose, this allowed the HPFP drive to have significant play, during timing alignment I heard a click and immediately all play in the cam chain and HPFP was gone, it looks like the chain tensioner somehow got stuck, I will be replacing it and re-assembling the engine, I will report back if the P0088 code goes away and stays gone.

If this is the correct diagnoses, it may save some folks a little time and work. In this engine with only 76K I was skeptical about excessive chain wear (stretch) and wondered why the tensioner did not compensate.

Just my2 cents. I would not run this engine until you are able to replace timing component and confirm everything. I believe 3.6 is an interference engine

 

[Coastal CC 3.6]

Just my2 cents. I would not run this engine until you are able to replace timing component and confirm everything. I believe 3.6 is an interference engine

I appreciate your .02

That said, I was an ASE certified mechanic for many years and owned my own shop here for several years working on mostly Euro to include Porsche (definitely and interference motor), I'll be careful.

 

[mellofello9]

This is one of a few I have found and compared to my issue, identical.

My question was to see if anyone had different findings before I pull either the engine or the trans to replace all of the timing chain and associated hardware on a car with 76K and a complete maintenance history, I am finding it a little hard to believe the chain wear as a factor.

Since this post was started,
I have pulled the valve cover and the chain and top chain guide are very clean and I see virtually no wear on the nylon guide.

Not a professional opinion but, from what I've gleaned whilst lurking the boards for years, 76K seems way too early for chains to be shot. Hopefully it was, as you said, just the adjuster being bound up. 🍻

 

[mellofello9]

Yeah I was wondering about the same. But after I read the TSB I linked above. It look like this code is just a byproduct of stretched chain. Chain stretches more than 8 degrees which makes the cam follower to be either 8degrees "to early" or "too late" to compress on the HPFP. That then sets of "pressure to high" for that given instance of time.

Thank you for sharing this, never occurred to me. Makes perfect sense, too. 🍻

 

[Coastal CC 3.6]

So because I am just a bit anal I wanted to be as positive as I can be regarding this issue, since I have the engine open I went into the #1 cyl and verified TDC along with Crank Mark, I installed the cam locator plate (without having to move the cams, I inspected the chain and guides for wear almost none visible) and then pulled the tensioner, everything is in perfect alignment and found the tensioner to have what I call catches, meaning it does not operate smoothly, in fact I could get it to stick by simply pushing it in and out in my hand, looking at it closely, I suspect poor machining from the factory.

Note: I also snaked my inspection camera down the chain as far as I could and did not see any guide ware.

I have ordered a new tensioner and all required gaskets, will post the results of the P0088 code check once the car is running again in a few days

Not sure if my attempt to help others is received well but if you happen to have this issue and you take it to a dealer or an independent, you may find a hefty bill as access to the cam system for replacement requires pulling either the engine or the trans.

 

[Coastal CC 3.6]

So because I am just a bit anal I wanted to be as positive as I can be regarding this issue, since I have the engine open I went into the #1 cyl and verified TDC along with Crank Mark, I installed the cam locator plate (without having to move the cams, I inspected the chain and guides for wear almost none visible) and then pulled the tensioner, everything is in perfect alignment and found the tensioner to have what I call catches, meaning it does not operate smoothly, in fact I could get it to stick by simply pushing it in and out in my hand, looking at it closely, I suspect poor machining from the factory.

Note: I also snaked my inspection camera down the chain as far as I could and did not see any guide ware.

I have ordered a new tensioner and all required gaskets, will post the results of the P0088 code check once the car is running again in a few days

Not sure if my attempt to help others is received well but if you happen to have this issue and you take it to a dealer or an independent, you may find a hefty bill as access to the cam system for replacement requires pulling either the engine or the trans.

For those of you who own one of these 3.6 engines, I am going to suggest an inexpensive maintenance item, for about $50.00 or less you can pick up a new Upper Timing Chain Tensioner, this item is located on the back side of the engine just below the valve cover between the engine and firewall, it simply screws in and requires no special tools to replace. get you one and replace the existing, this could save you thousands of dollars and downtime.

I found my tensioner stuck and allowing my timing chain to slap around (fortunately I caught this within 4 miles of low speed driving) and because it rides on only a few teeth, the HPFP can easily jump timing (as mine did), depending on who and how the repairs are done (typically the conclusion is worn/stretched chains), you could end up spending a lot replacing perfectly good timing chains, guides and the culprit a poorly manufactured tensioner.