[surfstar]

I purchased a GOOLOO portable tire inflator 300 PSI air compressor, DC 12V
Just plug into the rear lighter socket and in less than 2 minutes the bags are filled to the number you want.
It works fast, when I want and don't have to rely on those pay as you go air pumps at stations.

I use a bike pump and it takes less than 30 seconds. I think I count 12-15 strokes and its pretty close to 30-35 psi.

 

[scirockalot8v]

Need to get some.

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[Dieseldog12]

I use a bike pump and it takes less than 30 seconds. I think I count 12-15 strokes and its pretty close to 30-35 psi.

yeah my milwalkee inflator takes about 10 seconds to go from flat to 15psi there isn't much expansion of those bags, if I go lower it sometimes overshoots which is nice to see the read out of the pressure on the display (similar to that bike pump).

 

[Hoble]

Had to get some 2x4s today and dont have a trailer hitch yet. Made some roof racks out of 1x6s. Realized when I got there I didnt bring anything to inflate the bags and I wasnt paying 1$ at the gas station for 5 seconds of use... so I drove half way home with the 5 psi I normally have in the bags before I came to a free air spot where I put 12 psi in. That stiffened up the butt nicely and brought the ride hight up to where it was prior to the 2x4s on the roof.

Now I really have to buy a 12v air pump... loving the bags however!!!

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[3611519]

Ok found this from Facebook VW Altrack Owners group, digging down thru posts and links: Bearded Detailers development on his (NLA) lift kit - snd his test on blue Firestone 4176 airbags:

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[3611519]

Here is a link to Air Lift, which competes with Firestone on bags that fit many cars and trucks- use the "universal kit" option by measuring inside springs by width and height

Sometime in the spring one of my bags got a tear. Went to air up for a trip to the Home Depot but only heard air escaping. According to Airlift's FAQ, a horizontal tear is a result of insufficient air pressure which I think is what happened as I wasn't really keeping any pressure in them. Lesson learned. So with 1 bag still in working order i decided to order another kit instead of a replacement bag since the cost was about the same.

Cutting out the old bag was slow and tedious but installation this time around was a breeze. Instead of working from underneath the car, I took the wheel off and worked them in from the side. When I deflated the bag I shaped it in a specific way and used a zip tie hold its shape. Sprayed some soapy water and had the bag in about 5 minutes.

Still fussing with a leak/kink on my installed Firestone 4176s, but found this that might help others to consider the AirLift bags. Note you HAVE to get the size of the bag right.
https://www.airliftcompany.com/workshop/air-lift-1000-universal-air-spring-kit/

I like that the Air Lifts come with a spacer that helps protect the air line coming out of the end of the bag-
The Firestone does NOT include a spacer, and I wish I had known about that, just because what I found when installing it-

I installed mine with the air line UP, vs traditional Jeep-SUV-truck DOWN,
because I wanted to avoid the loop of line catching on things, where it comes out of the bottom of the "lower control line"- see diagram- for anyone a N00b like me that has trouble remembering the correct terminology...
https://parts.vw.com/a/Volkswagen_2017_Alltrack/54538530__7176843/REAR-SUSPENSION/9272767.html

However, that hole at the top inside of the spring going into the frame rail is tight, as is the little u-shaped gap in the frame rail on the inside that I routed out thru... no way to know if it kinked inside there, and I dont WANT to drill in frame rails if I dont have to...so back to the use of a spacer at top- might be the key to avoiding pinching at the top of the bag... just saying.

The kinks and pinches you have to watch out for in the surprisingly light air lines are the weak spot of these kits, IMHO-
but apparently once you get it right they can last a long time, per user reviews in a variety of places, including e-trailer.
https://www.etrailer.com/Vehicle-Suspension/Firestone/F4176.html

I list the above link noting that E-trailer does NOT yet endorse the fit on the Alltrack,
but just like on the various hitch kits and wiring harnesses that GolfMk7 users (including me- ecohitch 2" and Curt Wiring Harness) there HAVE used and confirmed worked, as early adopters, I find E-trailer to be a good resource for what other users say works, along with people sharing at VWVO, and elsewhere.

Airbags done right can solve the saggy butt issue, when loaded, towing, etc. There are tons of youtubes out there but here is a useful generic one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tmcKIJo1D8g

 

[Dieseldog12]

Well the honeymoon is over for my Air Lift bags, they will hold air 10-20PSI but only for a few hours if that.

I haven't had a chance to spray soapy water around to find the leak but lasted prob 2-3 months.

I don't look forward to dropping the rear control arms again.

 

[scirockalot8v]

Damn I was about to buy a set this weekend. Dont seem like any of these last long.

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[Hoble]

Mine are still in good shape it seems... maybe a line came loose or a wear hole in a line or something?

Fingers crossed

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[3611519]

Mine are still in good shape it seems... maybe a line came loose or a wear hole in a line or something?

Fingers crossed

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I'm testing my second set of bags:
AirLines sized to fit taller and narrower than the only Firestone 4176 option that IMHO is too short and too fat- results in bag getting tugged up and down by spring. See my earlier post about using the universal springs option on AirLines site.

Let you know how it goes: routed lines out bottom this time, armored with springline:

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[syntrix]

I'm testing my second set of bags:
AirLines sized to fit taller and narrower than the only Firestone 4176 option that IMHO is too short and too fat- results in bag getting tugged up and down by spring. See my earlier post about using the universal springs option on AirLines site.

Let you know how it goes: routed lines out bottom this time, armored with springline:

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Are you being snarky, or are you saying that Firestone products are a failure, and need to be recalled for this application? I know a guy in a shady law office :laugh::laugh:

 

[3611519]

Are you being snarky, or are you saying that Firestone products are a failure, and need to be recalled for this application? I know a guy in a shady law office :laugh::laugh:

Heh! ISWYDT...

No, I'm noting the Firestone bags are working for some but not others...

Seriously the info out there is scarce for cars, and scarcer for ATs
And the Amazon listings on bags, just like other products, dont always match up by different models.

So you might order one extracmodel of AirLift bag expecting to get a bag spacer and find out it is in the next bigger model...(like I did...)

Same for some other retailers, like e-trailer where people have put Firestones on Beetles, but are NOT listed as fitting ATs but yet a couple reviews infer they have been put in wagons, so you hope they might work fine under light use towing (like Christof the Bearded Detailer),

Or, Dieseldog, apparently, for awhile then not.

I think Firestones work better for awhile if you route lines down, as the bag is gonna want to fall down when deflated by gravity, and generally be at rest at bottom, only dragged up with lots of extra articulation and too tight fit while inflated, like on a rough road vs level towing.

In my case, the Firestones failed shortly after ruff road use -And here is why, I think:

the blue Firestones fit very tight width wise, and are shorter than the space inside the coil in height. So, they are gonna migrate some under lots of articulation. The question is, how much.

And thats why they tugged out the air valve on one of my bags and pinched the line just above the valve on the other, after a short while.

Because of that too tight fit and blue bag going up and down.

And because

On first try I routed the line up thru center hole above spring then thru a tight spot in frame, to protect against rocks and debris that I feared

If routing down out bottom of spring coil and control arm.

I hoped that top airline would slip a bit to give with the bag but

obviously didnt, per pics:

So, second try: taller skinnier bag and run the airline down this time. Like Christof does but unarmored using a 90 degree elbow. That gives a bit more flex but looks scary to me, waiting to be snagged by a tree root or desert sidewinder. Or the damn ground squirrels that chewed some wires...(another topic but check out Home Depots mice outta car product...)
Sorry, I digress.

Note: ya gotta go to the AirLift website to read their instructions on how to order right sized bags with universal fit:

measure the spring inside dimensions on your vehicle.

Then find closest to fit AirLift red bag, by that spring dimension, vs go by model number as used by others, like Firestone blue 4176.

If you do, you will see the AirLift instruction "in case of doubt to order one step smaller bag"
(they dont specify smaller by height or width- but your options are a 3" dia bag, or a 3.5" dia bag, similar to the Firestone blue 4176.)

So I chose the skinnier 3" bag this time.

Vs the old Firestone bag first time

Now, I'm a gonna test the AirLines on the same road same load, and
See how the AirLines hold up.

(plus new steelies/nokkias and plus my secret cheater EMD rake rear pad for an extra 13/32 in case the Airlines fail too)

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[syntrix]

Heh!

:laugh::laugh:

Gotta have a little sense of humor, glad you got it :thumbup::thumbup:

Yeah, tricky sometimes, but you have to take the chance. Glad you are sharing the info though!

 

[3611519]

:laugh::laugh:

Gotta have a little sense of humor, glad you got it :thumbup::thumbup:

Yeah, tricky sometimes, but you have to take the chance. Glad you are sharing the info though!

Yer welcome.

Now, just for fun...
I'll toss the hand grenade in the room...

How many of you replace the stretch bolts and nuts every time that you remove them...

Whats the torque, Kenneth?

Bueller?

Have a nice weekend!
(Evilll chuckle, runs away...)




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[surfstar]

My Air Lift bags have been going strong for over 3 years and 53k miles.
No leaks, no issues.
Inflation valve pointed down, air lines tucked up with zip ties, so they still hang down ~1/2-3/4" below the LCA. No snagging issues yet, and we do dirt roads on occasion.

I remember reading a few more bag failures with the Firestone vs the Air Lift when I was researching. Both have warranties and should send you a new bag if asked. Seeing as the labor is 99% of the PITA for these, that doesn't help much, though!

An idea of our camping gear for summer trips: full car camping setup, rock climbing gear, and two inflatable SUP boards. Inflate the bags to 35 psi - no sag. Great bang for the buck!

 

[3611519]

My Air Lift bags have been going strong for over 3 years and 53k miles.
No leaks, no issues.
Inflation valve pointed down, air lines tucked up with zip ties, so they still hang down ~1/2-3/4" below the LCA. No snagging issues yet, and we do dirt roads on occasion.

I remember reading a few more bag failures with the Firestone vs the Air Lift when I was researching. Both have warranties and should send you a new bag if asked. Seeing as the labor is 99% of the PITA for these, that doesn't help much, though!

An idea of our camping gear for summer trips: full car camping setup, rock climbing gear, and two inflatable SUP boards. Inflate the bags to 35 psi - no sag. Great bang for the buck!

Awesome! and inspiring for other AdventureTraks.
Thanks!
-Foo


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[allroadstomtl]

Airlift is a gem. I've already had a full load this summer moving family, Thule box loaded, full rear cargo and full rear outside basket. Added 35 to 40 lbs and no issues whatsoever. Now I'm getting ready to travel south in couple of weeks with the same config. Excited !

 

[Moonwalker]

Well the honeymoon is over for my Air Lift bags, they will hold air 10-20PSI but only for a few hours if that.

I haven't had a chance to spray soapy water around to find the leak but lasted prob 2-3 months.

I don't look forward to dropping the rear control arms again.

It sounds like a leak in the line like Hoble mentioned. If it was the bag, I doubt it would hold any pressure.


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[Dave Weitzenhof]

It sounds like a leak in the line like Hoble mentioned. If it was the bag, I doubt it would hold any pressure.


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When I worked at Firestone, I tested these Airlift helper springs under all kinds of temperature and load conditions. If the unit itself failed, the air loss was pretty much instantaneous. Slow leaks were always in the air line, its attachments, or elsewhere.

 

[Dieseldog12]

Yeah I have both valves pointed down then hoses running up to a T by the center hitch hole under the bumper, so it'll be easy for me to check the T and the fill valve, then it'd only lead to the bag valves themselves, which will be a PITA to drop the rear sway arms.

Easiest for me to check but I don't have a tool is the valve core, one of the fill valves core was loose or leaking so I used the other, but again I didn't hear any audible leakage when i tossed 20# in the bags. Time to fine a core tool.

Also I did order 80753 kit, they def seem wider and longer than what Foodogg has pictured.