VW Vortex - Volkswagen Forum banner
  • Mwerks and Fourtitude have rejoined VWVortex. For more info, see this thread.

21 - 40 of 56 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,708 Posts
Platinum, in your search for financing, did the year of the boat have any affect on rates? should i look for a low hour boat or year young boat? or does it not really matter if the condition is good? also, what features add to the value?

i'd like to get something i don't have to finance, but would rather finance a cherry of a boat than pay out of pocket for one that i then need to keep sinking money into. also, by financing, i can use my available cash on hand to address anything that might pop up.

what sort of rates are we talking, too? 5%? 10-15%?
You might find its cheaper, on a per month basis, to finance a nicer boat that it is to pay cash for an older one, when you factor in repairs, maintenance, refurbishing, etc.

That said, I found this for $5,500 as you see it, and all I had to do to it was polish, wax, new battery, and a tune up:



There are deals out there if you know where to look.

Regarding financing, condition is much more important than hours. Condition can be a factor if, like Platinum says, the bank values the boat too low. In my case, I financed my '86 Bayliner for 5 years at 4 something % interest through USAA. They originally didn't want to come up to $5,500 until I showed them pictures of the boat. They agreed that the condition was better than expected and justified the cost.

Features that add to value include: Upgraded power, full canvas (bimini top, mooring cover, etc), trailer (some boats did not come standard with a trailer and it should be evaluated separately - Bayliners below 21 feet came standard with a trailer and I use that against the seller who wants more money because the boat is on a trailer). Electronics generally add nominal money unless it has something like an awesome GPS chartplotter.

Sometimes features and condition cancel each other out. At the under $10,000 price point, things like trailer tires, bad wiring, or an engine misfire can remove thousands off the price because it could be a simple fix, or serious bucks to replace.

For this reason, I told Platinum what I will tell you: IN the under $10,000 price range, a nicer boat thats a couple grand more could potentially save you thousands later on in big time repairs if you find an engine with a dead cylinder, or a rotten transom.

Unless you know damn good and well what you are doing (and I do), buying super cheap is a major risk. Another thing PLatinum is finding out - anyone can buy a boat, and there could be huge differences in condition between otherwise identical models in your area simply because boats tend to attract idiots.

I have seen beautiful 30 foot express cruisers reduced to junk due to neglect, abuse, and ignorance.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,708 Posts
New boat rates seem to range between 4.49% and 6.75%.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,708 Posts
this thread is relevant to my interests.

i'm on the east coast, but close enough to take advantage of the MA/NH lakes region. I'm looking for a bowrider or deckboat in the 17-20' range to be able to tow/launch for day use with the family. we'd probably use it mostly in fresh with minimal in-bay salt use (and being flushed after each regardless)
Make DAMN SURE that whatever you buy does NOT have a painted steel trailer. HEre in FreshwaterVille Midwest, it's not an issue. On the coasts, painted trailers disintegrate with even occasional salt water dunkings. You will want to make sure you want a galvanized or aluminum trailer. They aren't as pretty, but they are far more durable.

i've been looking on craigslist and boattrader, but have found a significant difference in prices between the two.

i'm looking for I/O's, and pretty much everything i've found is mid to late 90's 3.0 merc powered. also, i've seemed to notice a lot of the boats in this size class and from this era are pretty much the same thing, with minor differences in upholstry and name. were most of these made by some big conglomerate that slapped different badges on them for different markets?
No, but depending on your size and price range, there's only so much you can do with an 18 foot boat layout if you are shopping bowriders. Its why I say brands aren't as important as condition and layout.

What brands are you looking at?

lastly, is the concern of "two-piece" boats getting damaged by rough water a notable concern, and how does one go about checking for that?

thanks.
Not sure what you are getting at here. Almost all boats are two or more pieces in construction, even the unsinkable brands like Boston Whaler.

You will want to look at the hull to deck joint, and that is always behind the rub rail on the boat. The only way to look at this is to examine the fiberglass around the rub rail for spider-webbing and signs of impact damage. You can also inspect this from inside the boat if you can gain access to the joint from a storage area, but in general this is very hard to do.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,371 Posts
good to know about the painted trailer. they do look pretty tho.

I've been looking at every brand, no one seems to outweigh the other. it's condition that matters.

here's a few that have caught my eye

upper limit - might finance

http://providence.craigslist.org/bod/4486039085.html

http://providence.craigslist.org/boa/4470836424.html



pay cash for

http://providence.craigslist.org/boa/4477918475.html

http://providence.craigslist.org/boa/4485153411.html

*edit

RE: the boat construction thing

http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-forum/266249-2-piece-vs-3-piece-boat.html
http://www.dusky.com/wordpress/732/

i guess how the boat is made makes a difference to the longevity, especially when used in ocean environments when you're beating it against the swells all day, as opposed to a smooth lake with a few wake to cross
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,708 Posts
good to know about the painted trailer. they do look pretty tho.

I've been looking at every brand, no one seems to outweigh the other. it's condition that matters.

here's a few that have caught my eye

upper limit - might finance

http://providence.craigslist.org/bod/4486039085.html

http://providence.craigslist.org/boa/4470836424.html



pay cash for

http://providence.craigslist.org/boa/4477918475.html

http://providence.craigslist.org/boa/4485153411.html

*edit

RE: the boat construction thing

http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-forum/266249-2-piece-vs-3-piece-boat.html
http://www.dusky.com/wordpress/732/

i guess how the boat is made makes a difference to the longevity, especially when used in ocean environments when you're beating it against the swells all day, as opposed to a smooth lake with a few wake to cross

All of these are 17 footers. I would strongly consider upping your budget, going with a same year 18 or 19 footer, and financing it over 5 years. Boats don't depreciate like cars - you only use boats a few times a year, 6 months out of the year. With a car, we're familiar with them in 1 year and tired of them by 3 (or at least, I am. ;) ) but with boats, that familiarity curve is longer. It makes more sense to stretch boat financing out to lower the payment on a nicer, newer boat.

Boats shrink in the water, and I would encourage you to move up to a 19 footer or so. The room and ride difference is palpable, and you will likely be happier with the boat longer.

Regarding the 2 piece thing, I would be VERY careful what you read about on The Hull Truth. My personal opinion is that they are elitist f*** heads with no sense of reality. Every answer to a boat is a used Bertram with inboards because they are serious saltwater enthusiasts. It would be similar to going to a Bentley owners forum and asking questions about your first or second car - their advise, while instructive, is not based in your reality. If you post any of those Craigslist boats on THT, you will get the crap flamed out of you - ESPECIALLY Bayliner.

I can go into brands if you want - I am a huge Bayliner fan and have owned 3, even from the bad years of the mid 1980s. For the money and the way they are designed for room and space, I just don't think you can do better if you are a non-wealthy working stiff. But that is another chat for another day.

Find a boat that has obviously been cared for. Even a CL ad will give you a clue - Platinum found a boat owner who cared for his boat, had a thick stack of receipts, knew what the boat was and what it was called, and in general, was informed.

I can't tell you how many times I read an ad that goes like this:

"1988 [nope, it was an '86] BayLine 25 foot Serra [it's a 2450 Ciera, and the model is on the side of the boat you twit], Vulva Pinto GM engine [It's a Volvo Penta, and looking at your blurry pic, its very obvious you put a junkyard engine in from a 1978 GMC half ton). Mint, must see!"

Clearly we aren't dealing with someone who has a proper number of chromosomes here, and I wouldn't bother looking at this boat.

See what I mean?
 

·
Registered
7.4, 5.7. 2.0T
Joined
·
18,399 Posts
Discussion Starter #28 (Edited)
FV-QR

Well, the sea trial went perfectly. Small lake but we got it up to 40+ mph. It would have gone faster with more room and/or less weight. Owner even changed the fluids for me last night.

Wife and kids are leaving with the in-laws tomorrow for a weekend trip to WI for a wedding. Hopefully, Maximum_Download’s wife will let him come out to play as I could use a hand launching it from the slip and taking it over to the marina for in-out rack storage ;)







 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,708 Posts
****, that looks cleaner in your pics than it did in the ad. If I didn't know any better I would say it looked brand new.

You did just fine. And don't worry, we will get out to hang out with you some time. :)

As for trailering, all I can tell you is go slow, and practice. Put your hand on the bottom of the steering wheel and turn in the direction you want the boat to turn, when backing up. You need a spotter in tight spots because you cannot see behind the boat, and that outdrive is pretty pricy if you run it into something like a concrete pylon.

When you launch:

1. You need a checklist in your head. Mine went something like this: Covers off, blower on, DRAINPLUG IN!!!!!, keys in ignition, coolers and bags in the boat, lines on, fenders on, TRAILER TIE DOWNS OFF!!!!.

2. Do this all in the prep area please, NOT on the ramp itself.

3. GO SLOWLY...take your time. The guy behind you can wait, and he will be waiting a lot longer if you rush it and screw up/hit something/sink the boat/sink the truck. ;)

4. Don't be too proud to ask for help. We all had to start somewhere, and boaters are about the friendliest and most helpful people out there.

5. Relax when launching. Especially with Cathy and the kids....get stressed out and start yelling, and that's how days get ruined.

To launch the boat:

1. Line up with the pier, and start backing down slowly. Just to recap, the tie downs are now off the stern, the blower is on, keys are in the ignition, and you're ready to rock and roll.

2. The only thing holding the boat to the trailer is the winch strap and safety chain in front.

3. Back down slowly (some ramps are steep and slippery, so go slow and gauge your traction), and dunk the boat down to about 1 foot over the tops of the trailer fenders. Then shift to Drive and pull up just so the water is breaking over the fender tops. The idea here is you want to soak the bunks and then position the trailer so the boat slides off, not floating and only on the trailer by the tip of the bow. The soaked bunks will let the boat slide off easier.

Retrieval is the reverse of this process....back the trailer down, soak the bunks, position the trailer so the water is just breaking over the fenders.

Things you need:

1. Sandals. You are going to get your feet wet on the ramp, and on a hot day you will learn to enjoy it.

2. Safety equipment - we discussed this in an earlier post. Get this immediately and do not leave the dock until you have it.


Tips:

1. Upsize the bilge pump. Hardly any small boat makers put an adequate bilge pump in the boat.
2. Ensure the pump you have works, and has an automatic float switch that works.

Thats actually all I can think of right now. I know Susan deep sixed a trip out this weekend, so I can't make it. But we can keep trying.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,708 Posts
Only other thing I can think of -

Do you understand how your power trim and tilt works?

Do you have any questions you need answered?
 

·
Registered
7.4, 5.7. 2.0T
Joined
·
18,399 Posts
Discussion Starter #34 (Edited)
FV-QR

They had Coast Guard inspections at the ramp this morning. Passed and got my sticker. Eventful free launch. Water was smooth (Lake St. Clair). Opened her up to 50+ mph with my brother and I plus a full tank of fuel. Beautiful day. Was out for a couple hours. Ran great. Super excited to do it some more. She is sleeping in her new home now - inside in/out rack storage at Hideaway Harbor Marina.
 

·
Registered
7.4, 5.7. 2.0T
Joined
·
18,399 Posts
Discussion Starter #36 (Edited)
FV-QR

My family is addicted. Already dreaming about bigger boats - bow riders in the 23-26 foot range with pump-out heads. However, it will likely be a couple years before we are truly financially ready to upgrade (my wife is a stay at home mom and will be going to back to work when our ~3 year old starts school).

Here is my dream boat, a 2012 Cobalt 242 with 8.1L 400hp Volvo DuoProp. Best part is my wife agrees that it would be an awesome boat:



Yesterday, for S&G, I looked at a 2004 Chaparral 230 SSi with 5.7L 320HP DP:



Lots of options:

Loaded with features and options.
• Stainless steel dual prop
• Head
• Snap-out carpeting
• Snap-out wind screen
• Dual batteries
• Compass
• Digital depth gauge
• Stereo/CD with premium speakers
• Fish finder/Chart plotter/GPS
• VHF radio with DSC
• Pressurized water system
• Transom shower
• Swim board with barbeque mount
• Removable barbeque grill
• Custom tarp for high speed towing
• Removable bait tank and spare pump
• All necessary accessories included
• Heavy duty, galvanized trailer
• Surge brakes
• Spare tire
• New brake pads and rotors
• Many more features (skis, wake board, life jackets, etc.)
However, the tropical trees, California registration and galvanized trailer made me question if it was a salt water boat. And it was.

230 Seller said:
The pictures were taken in California just before I brought it here to Michigan. The boat has been used in the ocean but has always been thoroughly flushed with fresh water and salt neutralizer. I have maintenance records and there are no problems with the boat. But it's ten years old so there are a few signs of use.
The seller, a 70 year old guy bought the boat new when he was living in the San Diego area and moved back to Michigan a few years ago. He had maintenance records but the manifolds and risers are original. Interior was in good shape overall with just a stain from a spare tire resting against the bow cushion. Only had the trailer cover too but I would absolutely need a snap-on bow/cockpit cover.

As Matt told me, "You can maintain a saltwater boat but you're basically buying a northern car in Arizona. Why?" Makes complete sense. Also, we are not ready to buy the new boat now and having two boats at a time while selling our H180 would not be feasible. We would have to put money into the 230 right away including new manifolds/risers plus bow/cockpit covers. Plus, we would have to store two boats at a time

I will check back when we are truly ready to upgrade.

Our H180 has been great, the only issue is the power cut out after hitting a wave and I figured it out myself...one of the two wires going to the kill switch fell off. Easy fix.

I have added a GPS unit (handy for a large like like St Clair) and 12v plug (cannot believe it did not come with one). I also replaced the prop. Went from a SS 14.25 x 23p to a SS 14 x 21p and love it. The issue with the 14.25 x 23p was it appeared to be over-propped with top speed coming at 4200-4400 RPM. The new prop has the same top speed but comes around 4800 RPM, right where it is supposed to be. The hole-shot is much improved as well. Plus it looks nice and shiny.



Meanwhile, here are a couple photos from this season:

Done for the day...



Our excited 6-year old, Bobby, waving to my in-laws on the boat (38' Carver) in the distance.



Bobby's first solo ride. He was content @ 2.5 mph when this pic was taken. Within an hour, he was going 15-20 mph!

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,537 Posts
Glad I came across this thread, great info in here!

Congrats Platinum on the new boat, it looks fantastic!


We're shopping for inboard ski boats in the $8k - $12k range.

Had a deal lined up on a Ski Nautique that fell through. Considering that we are half way through our boating season now I think we'll wait and try to find a great deal over the winter.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,708 Posts
Glad I came across this thread, great info in here!

Congrats Platinum on the new boat, it looks fantastic!


We're shopping for inboard ski boats in the $8k - $12k range.

Had a deal lined up on a Ski Nautique that fell through. Considering that we are half way through our boating season now I think we'll wait and try to find a great deal over the winter.
The time to look is NOW. Not when the boats are put away.

Owners are starting to think about winterization and storage costs - that means the time to bargain is from now to mid September. Plus, you never buy a boat without a sea trial, which is hard to do when the water is frozen.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,537 Posts
Good points on timing the search.

Will keep my eyes open from now through end of season.
 

·
Registered
7.4, 5.7. 2.0T
Joined
·
18,399 Posts
Discussion Starter #40 (Edited)
***

UPDATE - IF YOU CANNOT SEE THE PHOTOS, PLEASE READ:

Add-ons for Chrome and Firefox have been developed that allow you to see Photobucket photos. I am using it for Chrome and it works great.

Chrome: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/photobucket-embed-fix/naolkcpnnlofnnghnmfegnfnflicjjgj

Firefox: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/photobucket-embedded-fix/


***

Well, we upgraded sooner than I thought. A 2000 Cobalt 246 w/Merc 454 Magnum (385HP) and 319 hours. In my search, I could not find another Cobalt 246 with a 454 Magnum, the 7.4L MPI with 310HP was much more common. The 454 Magnum has forged internals vs cast for the standard 7.4L.

We made it home safe Saturday with our new boat and about 900 miles roundtrip to and from Western Maryland. Our 3- and 7-year-old sons were good on the trip as well. The seller was nice and he even took us out to dinner Friday night when we arrived in town.

He had new trailer tires installed, trailer bearings greased and even purchased spare wheel before we arrived. The sea trial was Saturday morning. About a week before, the forecast called for high-60’s but of course it was only 40 degrees on the lake the day of. Even with the cold, the sea trial was great and it really flew. The boat ran excellent and was in really good condition overall as described. Service techs gave it a thumbs up.

The only thing that is a bummer is the outdrive looks worse in person than it did in pictures. The anodes were good but the outdrive is pitted and missing some paint…I have noticed this more on Mercs than on Volvos. The boat did stay in the water a lot before but will never be in the water even over night when we use it. I am going to get some quotes on having it sanded and repainted (I am kind of OCD). The prop was in great shape though.

We spent a few hours doing a really deep inside the boat yesterday including taking out the snap in carpet and cleaning the floors. We are going to rent a steam cleaner to make the carpet look like new. I also added a spare wheel carrier from Harbor Freight.

The hull is just a bit hazy so I have a guy coming to my house tomorrow to give her a good rub/wax. Might have the engine compartment detailed too.







 
21 - 40 of 56 Posts
Top