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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I took delivery of my .:R32 this afternoon. While the car was up on the lift for snow tires/wheels, I looked around with particular focus on the Haldex Coupling Flange as mentioned by 3.2 VReihenmotor 6 in an earlier thread. Same problem with my car, i.e., one of the three studs was missing the required nut and washers. I have no idea how this assembled at the factory, but if done from below, it is easy to see that one of the 3 studs is hidden and could be overlooked.
CHECK YOUR CAR. This is easy to spot.
IMPORTANT UPDATE (16Feb'04): this is NOT a problem and you should NOT add nuts and/or washers should you discover bare studs. Per VW, the front facing studs on the coupling are for balance "weights". If you find a bare stud, leave it alone.



Modified by GelbM3 at 4:24 PM 2-16-2004
 

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Re: IMPORTANT: Missing Hardware Followup (GelbM3)

Could one of you guys post up a pic to help people out??? I wont likely have my car for several months, but I'd like the info so I can be ready!!! Thanks!
-jfost
 

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Re: IMPORTANT: Missing Hardware Followup (GelbM3)

yeah - possible to post a pic or more detail of where?
Can it be seen without being on a lift?
Thanks!
 

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Re: IMPORTANT: Missing Hardware Followup (GelbM3)

The nut and washers were missing omn my R32 also. The head service tech said he'd look into it and in the mean time overnight the correct nut and washers that were listed in the parts look-up. He mentioned it may be a balance thing but was going to put a call into VWoA to get a deffinite answer. I originally heard about this here on the vortex so I told him others were seeing the same thing. I'll post again when I hear concrete info on the issue.
 

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Re: IMPORTANT: Missing Hardware Followup (GelbM3)

GelbM3,
This is so bizarre and frightening! I was really hoping that no one else would encounter this problem. When I noticed the bare stud, it looked as if the threads were still black, meaning that a nut was likely never screwed on. In other words, that rules out the possibility that a nut (and washers) were put on, then came off due to a lack of tightness. As this problem has been discovered on three cars so far, I'm willing to believe that there are more affected cars--maybe many, many more. It's strange that no one has chimed in reporting that all three nuts and accompanying washers were there. We need to know if there are cars that have all three nuts and washers in place. I seriously doubt that VW deliberately "left off" one of the three nuts. With a little time and investigation, we'll find out. Any thoughts on this one, Jaime?
 

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Re: IMPORTANT: Missing Hardware Followup (3.2 VReihenmotor6)

You might get a better response from people if you explained where the Haldex Coupling Flange is or supplied a picture. I will look if you all tell me where it is. Thanks
 

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Re: IMPORTANT: Missing Hardware Followup (emanresu)

It's not very difficult to spot. The coupling is directly between each side of the gas tank, right in the middle toward the rear of the car. Where the drive axle mates to the rear AWD axles. Just follow the axle to the rear of the car and you will end up at the coupling. It's a big round black piece with 3 studs going thru it. I'll try to get a picture, the service manager took one while my car was on the lift yesterday, I'll see if he can email it to me. No official word on this issue from Volkswagen yet. I'll keep bugging them to find out. My guess is that it is this way on every R32. May be that way for a reason.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Re: IMPORTANT: Missing Hardware Followup (3.2 VReihenmotor6)

Quote, originally posted by 3.2 VReihenmotor6 »
GelbM3,
This is so bizarre and frightening! I was really hoping that no one else would encounter this problem. When I noticed the bare stud, it looked as if the threads were still black, meaning that a nut was likely never screwed on. In other words, that rules out the possibility that a nut (and washers) were put on, then came off due to a lack of tightness. As this problem has been discovered on three cars so far, I'm willing to believe that there are more affected cars--maybe many, many more. It's strange that no one has chimed in reporting that all three nuts and accompanying washers were there. We need to know if there are cars that have all three nuts and washers in place. I seriously doubt that VW deliberately "left off" one of the three nuts. With a little time and investigation, we'll find out. Any thoughts on this one, Jaime?

I believe that many cars will have this problem. 3.2 VReihenmotor6 is correct that the stud was pristine and never had a nut on it. This feels like an assembly process problem. I have some experience with mechanical assembly operations. I would expect that these parts were "kitted" at the factory (vs the operator grabbing hardware out of a bin). Thus any assembly operator would clearly have "left over parts" at the end ... unless the kit was incomplete (that happens too). So, I assume that either the parts were NOT kitted or the kit was incomplete.
My dealer was not prepared for the R32. There were several screwups in paperwork and this was the first R32 the mechanics had seen. I talked with the mechanic as we poked around under the car. We agreed that this type of problem would not be caught be any normal predelivery inspection. If anyone from VW is reading this, I recommend that the PDI be immediately updated to include this inspection.
 

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is this where the drive shaft goes into the rear diferential/haldex housing? I want to take a look at mine before I really get into driving the car hard.
Also, anyone else look under there car, are all the body holes filled, I have two that are open up front parallel to the front edge of the doors. the drivers side is a nice perfect circle, the passenger side is not, that concerns me, looks bent.
Anthony
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Re: (95GLX)

Quote, originally posted by 95GLX »
is this where the drive shaft goes into the rear diferential/haldex housing? I want to take a look at mine before I really get into driving the car hard.

yes
 

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Re: IMPORTANT: Missing Hardware Followup (GelbM3)

ok.. now that i know what i am looking for i will check it this weekend... so i guess my next question is how easy is it to get nut and washers... i guess i can get my dealer to order them.. right?
 

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Re: (ValveFloat)

This picture is perfect. You can clearly see where the bolt is missing. Between the 2 hex head bolts on the black coupling there is a stud without washers or a nut on it. If you rotate the axle and look at the other studs there will be 2 nuts attached to the studs that protrude thru this coupling. Good picture.
 

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Re: IMPORTANT: Missing Hardware Followup (BlueNJ.:R32)

Quote, originally posted by BlueNJ.:R32 »
ok.. now that i know what i am looking for i will check it this weekend... so i guess my next question is how easy is it to get nut and washers... i guess i can get my dealer to order them.. right?

Yes, but that may take awhile as VW probably doesn't have any parts for the car in stock. If the car is already sitting in your driveway or garage, I would recommend doing the following to spot and fix the problem (IF YOU HAVE THE NECESSARY TOOLS AND KNOW-HOW):
1) Put some wood blocks or bricks in front of and behind the front tires to prevent the car from rolling.
2) Put the gear shifter in neutral with the e-brake off.
3) With the car on a FLAT surface, use a floor jack to raise the car high enough to be able to work underneath it (jacking points can be found in the owner's manual under "lifting" in the index). Use jackstands in the appropriate areas in the rear of the car.
4) With a flashlight, slide under the rear of the car and find the flange (large black round piece in photo that has two nuts showing) that mates the driveshaft (long black shaft in photo that runs nearly the length of the car) with the Haldex coupling (the aluminum block-looking piece behind the flange).
5) There should be only two studs in view on the flange. Verify that each of these two studs has a nut, a lock washer, and two flat washers.
6) Rotate one of the rear tires to turn the flange to expose the third stud. Verify that the third stud also has the necessary nut (17 mm hex) and washers.
7) If you find that all three studs have the hardware described above, then your car doesn't have the problem. If one or more (hopefully not more) of the studs is missing the hardware, then do the following:
8) Remove an existing nut and the washers from one of the studs.
DO NOT DRIVE THE CAR AT THIS POINT
9) With the hardware you removed, take ANOTHER car to your local hardware/lumber store and ask a clerk to find you a matching nut, lock washer, and two flat washers. If possible, ask the clerk to give you the highest grade hardware (usually grade 8 or stainless steel, which is most likely stronger than the hardware VW used).
10) Replace the hardware you removed, and install the new hardware that was lacking. Verify that all three nuts are tight.
**NOTE: ONLY ATTEMPT FIXING IT YOURSELF IF YOU HAVE EXPERIENCE WORKING ON CARS. OTHERWISE, HAVE YOUR DEALER FIX IT.** It's likely that this may be a recall issue in the near future. Good luck to all. Thanks again for all the feedback and the handy photo.
**CRUCIAL POST REVISION: AS OF 2/16/04, IT IS THE CONSENSUS OF MANY FELLOW VORTEX MEMBERS, VW TECHNICIANS, AS WELL AS VW ITSELF (ACCORDING TO MEMBER GelbM3) THAT THE HARDWARE (NUTS AND WASHERS) USED ON THE BOLTS OF THE FLANGE/COUPLING ARE INTENDED FOR BALANCING PURPOSES. IF YOU DISCOVER A BOLT THAT LACKS HARDWARE, LEAVE IT ALONE! IT WAS LIKELY DONE ON PURPOSE. I APOLOGIZE FOR ALL THE MISUNDERSTANDINGS. IT WAS MY MISTAKE.**


Modified by 3.2 VReihenmotor6 at 8:23 PM 2-17-2004
 

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Re: (ValveFloat)

Quote, originally posted by ValveFloat »
That picture is from JuggeGTI's R32, a Euro one.

Either way here is what I was told from the sales manager at my dealership. He talked to a VW rep this morning. The reason for the missing hardware is to balance the driveline. That is why of you look closely there are an uneven number of washers on each stud that has a nut and washers. The way he explained it is that if you put a nut on it it will throw off the balance slightly and could cause a very slight vibration. So, that's what I found out, and I'm going to just leave mine how it is. It's been noted at my dealership so if there are any problems with the driveline later the warranty has to take care of it. But I'm not worried, they obviously have their reasoning. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif
 

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Re: (tdvw96)

Quote, originally posted by tdvw96 »
Either way here is what I was told from the sales manager at my dealership. He talked to a VW rep this morning. The reason for the missing hardware is to balance the driveline. That is why of you look closely there are an uneven number of washers on each stud that has a nut and washers. The way he explained it is that if you put a nut on it it will throw off the balance slightly and could cause a very slight vibration. So, that's what I found out, and I'm going to just leave mine how it is. It's been noted at my dealership so if there are any problems with the driveline later the warranty has to take care of it. But I'm not worried, they obviously have their reasoning. http://****************.com/smile/emthup.gif

Seems strange. Why is the stud (with the missing hardware) there in the first place? Without any hardware, it doesn't appear to serve a purpose. and it would seem to create an imbalance with the hardware lacking
. It just looks wrong to see a bare stud like that. I guess the only way we'll know for sure is from a full explanation from VWoA. Let's try to make this thread sticky until we know. I think this is very important.
 

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Re: (tdvw96)

Quote, originally posted by tdvw96 »
This picture is perfect. You can clearly see where the bolt is missing. Between the 2 hex head bolts on the black coupling there is a stud without washers or a nut on it. If you rotate the axle and look at the other studs there will be 2 nuts attached to the studs that protrude thru this coupling. Good picture.

I don't believe this photo shows a bare stud. I can only see two studs and I believe the third is hidden from view on the top side of the flange. I could be wrong.
 

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From the pic it looks to me like the cap head screws hold the thing together. The studs don't seem to be holding anything together.
Quote »
The reason for the missing hardware is to balance the driveline.

That makes some sense. It would be easier to add nuts and washers to balance the driveline than to have to weld on weights.
:edit: Of course now that I look closer there is a weight welded to the drive shaft.


Modified by ValveFloat at 12:01 PM 2-12-2004
 
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