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Just curious what cars came with that shifter pattern??
M3 (E30) - all or just special editions?
Porsche 928.
Any others?
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M3 (E30) - all or just special editions?
Porsche 928.
Any others?
Mass produced cars with racing shift patterns aka "dog leg first"??
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25,202 Posts
Re: Mass produced cars with racing shift patterns aka "dog leg first"?? (KARMANN_20V)
Porsche five-speeds of all models were this pattern for many years. My '68 912 was like this, typically. This includes the 924 model. The early 924s had a weak reverse lockout, and "walking" the shifter from first to second provoked many a reverse-gear crunch in those old dogs.
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Porsche five-speeds of all models were this pattern for many years. My '68 912 was like this, typically. This includes the 924 model. The early 924s had a weak reverse lockout, and "walking" the shifter from first to second provoked many a reverse-gear crunch in those old dogs.
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10,750 Posts
Re: Mass produced cars with racing shift patterns aka "dog leg first"?? (KARMANN_20V)
Wiki is your friend
Wiki is your friend
| Quote » |
| A dog leg gearbox is an unusual manual transmission layout, an up-over-up shift between first and second gear resembling the hind leg of a dog. Dog leg layout gearboxes are usually found on performance automobiles because in road racing it is rare to shift into first gear other than for the initial start or exiting a pit lane. Notable street cars to feature the dog leg layout are the Porsche 914, early 911, 924 Turbo (all featuring GETRAG gearboxes) and the Lamborghini Miura. A non-performance car to feature such a shift pattern is the Subaru 360. Also: Datsun 160J Hardtop SSS. A dog leg transmission has also been seen in odd places such as a 1980 Datsun 210 Wagon built during the 210/310 crossover. |
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Re: Mass produced cars with racing shift patterns aka "dog leg first"?? (vag-tan-klan)
Funny how Wiki missed the e30's.. Although none of the US Spec cars had doglegs, I've actually driven a gray market 323i with a stock dogleg.
| Quote, originally posted by vag-tan-klan » |
| Wiki is your friend |
Funny how Wiki missed the e30's.. Although none of the US Spec cars had doglegs, I've actually driven a gray market 323i with a stock dogleg.
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Re: Mass produced cars with racing shift patterns aka "dog leg first"?? (WannaCorrado)
My grandpas mustang is sorta like that, R is up and left, but I can't remember where 1 is.
(I have yet to be alloud to drive it.)
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My grandpas mustang is sorta like that, R is up and left, but I can't remember where 1 is.
(I have yet to be alloud to drive it.)
Re: Mass produced cars with racing shift patterns aka "dog leg first"?? (KARMANN_20V)
Euro-Spec E30 M3's had dog-leg shift patterns, U.S. spec cars did not.
MB 190E 2.3-16's had a dog leg shift pattern, some Porsche 924's.
| Quote, originally posted by KARMANN_20V » |
| Just curious what cars came with that shifter pattern?? M3 (E30) - all or just special editions? Porsche 928. Any others?
|
Euro-Spec E30 M3's had dog-leg shift patterns, U.S. spec cars did not.
MB 190E 2.3-16's had a dog leg shift pattern, some Porsche 924's.
Re: Mass produced cars with racing shift patterns aka "dog leg first"?? (Bixmen)
I think you're right. I'm pretty sure the idea was that, on a road-race track, 3rd-2nd downshifts and 2nd-3rd upshifts would be easier, because once you're on a track, you probably wouldn't be using 1st that much.
Modified by tehAndy at 11:47 AM 11-24-2006
| Quote, originally posted by Bixmen » |
| What's the advantage? faster shifts from 2-3 and 3-2? |
I think you're right. I'm pretty sure the idea was that, on a road-race track, 3rd-2nd downshifts and 2nd-3rd upshifts would be easier, because once you're on a track, you probably wouldn't be using 1st that much.
Modified by tehAndy at 11:47 AM 11-24-2006
Re: Mass produced cars with racing shift patterns aka "dog leg first"?? (Bixmen)
the principal theroy is that you get the least used gear out of the "H", thereby making each of the other shifts more natural.
Doing a straight back 4-5 shift at over 100mph is a lot easier than the same shift requiring an up and over movement.
I drove a BMW 3.0CSL across the United States and it had a gearbox with 1st gear back and to the left. It becomes 2nd nature after a bit.
| Quote, originally posted by Bixmen » |
| What's the advantage? faster shifts from 2-3 and 3-2? |
the principal theroy is that you get the least used gear out of the "H", thereby making each of the other shifts more natural.
Doing a straight back 4-5 shift at over 100mph is a lot easier than the same shift requiring an up and over movement.
I drove a BMW 3.0CSL across the United States and it had a gearbox with 1st gear back and to the left. It becomes 2nd nature after a bit.
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Re: Mass produced cars with racing shift patterns aka "dog leg first"?? (Bixmen)
Yep. By making the shift to reverse a "dogleg" it means there is one less dogleg when shifting through the other gears. 2-3 are the gears you would be using most during a tight road courseor an auto-x.
Most euro cars I have seen (VW's, MG's, Alfa, Fiat) have reverse up front, but I have never seen one that has first as a backward shift.
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| Quote, originally posted by Bixmen » |
| What's the advantage? faster shifts from 2-3 and 3-2? |
Yep. By making the shift to reverse a "dogleg" it means there is one less dogleg when shifting through the other gears. 2-3 are the gears you would be using most during a tight road courseor an auto-x.
Most euro cars I have seen (VW's, MG's, Alfa, Fiat) have reverse up front, but I have never seen one that has first as a backward shift.
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Maserati Biturbo of the '80s had a dogleg 1st. I was looking at one awhile back and feared the day I could drive it, launching from a stoplight in traffic. . . in reverse . . .
As mentioned above (I think), Lamborghini Diabolos had the dogleg pattern for awhile, but I don't know about the current lineup. Then again, I don't know how a dogleg is configured when you've got paddle shifters
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As mentioned above (I think), Lamborghini Diabolos had the dogleg pattern for awhile, but I don't know about the current lineup. Then again, I don't know how a dogleg is configured when you've got paddle shifters
Re: Mass produced cars with racing shift patterns aka "dog leg first"?? (a2a4raddo)
The getrag 5 speed with the racing pattern was an option, I think, in the mid-70's BMWs. And they came in the last run of Jensen Healeys in late '74 and 75. I have one, along with a spare transmission. The other thing that is nice is that top gear is 1:1, not an overdirve, so it's a nice close ratio transmission. It really is nice, though the shift linkage isn't the greatest.
The getrag 5 speed with the racing pattern was an option, I think, in the mid-70's BMWs. And they came in the last run of Jensen Healeys in late '74 and 75. I have one, along with a spare transmission. The other thing that is nice is that top gear is 1:1, not an overdirve, so it's a nice close ratio transmission. It really is nice, though the shift linkage isn't the greatest.
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