[nemo1ner]

I am posting here since this part of the Motorsport forum tends to get more views.

I am currently building a 1984 VW Rabbit GTI. I have mainly autocrossed; however, I want to venture into both NASA and SCCA PDX’s, HPDE’s, and Time Trials. Since the SCCA rulebook is the most ridiculous, I have been running to it constantly and have frequently gotten frustrated with the 800+page ridiculousness of it.

Initially, I felt that this car would be good in FSP, but now I am thinking that perhaps FSP will not be doable. I have recently finished the roll cage. It is a 6 point cage with no additional points of contact to the firewall, or gussets attaching to the body. The sunroof cassette has been removed and a steel delete panel has been riveted in over the hole (overlapping 1” along the outer edge) in order for the roll bar to be as close to the roof as possible. All of that is legal in FSP and FP.

The motor and trans are stock and still running the original CIS engine management. The original hatch, doors, and dash are in the car as well, but that is the extent of what I have OEM wise. The hood was damaged in a previous accident, but I have a carbon fiber replacement. I don’t believe the hood is legal in FSP.

Should I try to source the parts necessary to make it FSP legal, or should I consider other classes like FP? Is the MK1 GTI even competitive these days with all of the restructuring of classes?

I normally autocross an Audi TT in DS and perform well in my class, but I would like to step up into actual racing. But not to where I would simply become frustrated because my car is not competitive in its class.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated

 

[MusicCityGTI]

Based on SCCA national auto-x results the past few years, the MK1 seems to be most competitive in FSP. This year, the top 4 FSP spots all went to MK1's (rabbits and sciroccos), pretty much VW's may be "the" car for FSP. That said, many of the names winning in FSP are very familiar to those that have followed SCCA/VW results so much of the credit goes to those talented drivers also.

The next logical spot for the MK1 is Street Mod Front (SMF). I am a firm believer that a MK1 with the proper driver could win this class also. Yes, the Honda's have a more sophisticated rear suspension, and the thing that holds Hondas back in FSP is torque which can be fixed in SMF but I still feel the right driver in a VW could prevail.

Building a FSP MK1 auto-x car is an exercise in restraint. There are so many tempting power and suspension upgrades that are prohibited in FSP which is why my MK1 GTI is now built for SMF. In FSP trim, most of the MK1 8v engines will put down about 100-110 whp. In SMF you can run any VW engine and forced induction if you desire. You have more suspension allowances, you can run bigger brakes, rear disks, and a few other tweaks also. What you end up with is a car that still weighs about 2,000 lbs but now has 2x-3x the power, better brakes and better handling. It is just more fun!!! Also if you decide to to HPDE/track days, the added power and brakes will be welcome additions.

And yes the PAX in SMF isn't too bad either. I was able to top pax a few events this year in my 30 yr old GTI so these cars can definitely still be competitive.

Here is an engine bay pic of my car 1983 GTI. ABA block, Eurospec solid lifter head, Lysholm supercharger, megasquirt management:




Interior:

 

[nemo1ner]

Thanks for the reply. Although it used to be an autocross car, I am not really looking to autocross it. I would probably attend a few autocross events only for seat time and to help dial in suspension. Other than that, I'm not looking to be competitive there.

The problem is that all of then interior is gone. No headliner. No carpet. No door cards. Only the dash is left. I believe Prepared is the only class that allows a fully stripped down interior. I have seen MK1's run in EP and FP. I'm just not sure how well they are doing in those classes. FSP is quite good for autocross, but I don't think 100hp is going to cut it for time trials unless I cut a ton of weight. The car without motor,trans, fenders, doors and hatch is currently sitting at 900lbs.

 

[MusicCityGTI]

You are correct, no interior moves you straight to EP.

The good news is you can shave tons of weight in EP, the bad new is so can everyone else. The MK1 is probably an underdog for sure in EP. If you are just using auto-x as some fun seat time then who cares if you don't have the ideal set up. Sounds like track days are what you are more interest in so if auto-x is just going to be fun seat time then the car should be a blast regardless.

In EP, weight reduction will be paramount since you will be limited on power. If you can get the car to 1,700-1,800 lbs combined with 100-110 hp, the right suspension and brakes then the MK1 will be a fast little auto-x ride and still powerful enough to have fun on the track also.

Have fun.

 

[nemo1ner]

I just looked over the 2013 GCR appendix and it lists the MK1 GTI under HP, but the standard Rabbit and Cabriolet 1.8 in EP. Why are they in 2 different classes even with the same engine displacement?

 

[chois]

Um the GCR is for Club Racing. If you are worried about solo classification, look at the solo rules.

http://www.scca.com/solo/content.cfm?cid=44517

As far as GCR classification, the A1 is in HP(roduction) as a Level 2 prep (limited compression, limited cam, limited head work, stock rods, no dry-sump), FP as Level 1 prep (unlimited of all those things), ITB with a 1.8 or 1.7 and ITC with a 1.6. But I doubt any of those are reasonable for a street car...

 

[nemo1ner]

I said earlier that I was not interested in autocrossing it, but more PDX and time trials. I posted here because this forum receives more traffic.

 

[chois]

I said earlier that I was not interested in autocrossing it, but more PDX and time trials. I posted here because this forum receives more traffic.

Sorry - I missed the time trial bit.

 

[nemo1ner]

No prob. It makes sense to me now how they are classed.

 

[naterkane]

Thanks for the reply. Although it used to be an autocross car, I am not really looking to autocross it. I would probably attend a few autocross events only for seat time and to help dial in suspension. Other than that, I'm not looking to be competitive there.

The problem is that all of then interior is gone. No headliner. No carpet. No door cards. Only the dash is left. I believe Prepared is the only class that allows a fully stripped down interior. I have seen MK1's run in EP and FP. I'm just not sure how well they are doing in those classes. FSP is quite good for autocross, but I don't think 100hp is going to cut it for time trials unless I cut a ton of weight. The car without motor,trans, fenders, doors and hatch is currently sitting at 900lbs.

I have a Mk1 FSP car I'm building for a customer and between he and I we have a spare full interior... which would allow you to not only use the car with some practicality, but also run it in FSP (barring other illegal mods it may or may not have).

However, if you want to hill climb... in PA they run SCCA solo rules, but in vermont/new hampshire, everything is classed by multipliers... difficult to wrap your head around, but much more lenient when it comes to "run what you bring" guys.

 

[nemo1ner]

I have been reading up a lot on the hill climbs in PA. It seems that FP would be a good place for the car. It won't really see public road use and I already autocross an Audi TT in D Stock. I think the GTI will be much better at NASA events based on their classing structure (which I like more than the SCCA).