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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
My stock clutch started slipping with the integrated engineering stage 2 pro intake manifold tune. So the search for a new clutch began. Having had many different cars with many different aftermarket clutches, I know what I was looking for. I wanted a daily able clutch, quiet, street able, and yet something that could hold more power than I'll ever throw at it. Now that last part will only be determined over time, however a month of non stop research has led me to where I am now.

Sachs SRE pressure plate (PN: 883082001422)
OEM Sachs DMF (PN: 06F105266AH)
South Bend dxd stage 3 drop in disc (PN: SDTSI-OFE)

The logic behind this clutch choice is that the Sachs stage 1 & 2 clutch kits for the R use an organic disc and has been proven to hold 500+ ftlbs of torque. However I have also heard of this clutch slipping under very cold temps as well as high load high torque applications. This is a limit of the organic material. Hence where the SB disc comes in. I figured I would bite the bullet on this experiment and hopefully help a few ppl out along the way.

Initial driving impressions:
Picked the car up today. Had the clutch, vwr subframe mount, and Tyrol dead set out installed. This clutch is not for the faint of heart. I've had some heavy clutches in my day, and this is by far the heaviest! I don't mind because I hated the feel of the stock clutch, but this is just a warning up front. Start doing your leg presses!
As for the disc, it feels super grabby, yet forgiving at the same time. With a few more rpm's on take off it can be fairly smooth. There is some shudder that probably can't be avoided, but will possibly smooth out over time.
As for noise, stock! actually since the flywheel is brand slpankin new it is quieter than stock. Absolutely no chatter and no gear noise.
EDIT: Forgot to add, the engagement is literally, the top 5% of pedal travel. This is going to take some getting used to :) I ordered the BMW clutch stop because it feels like I'd put the the throw out bearing through the pressure plate if I put the pedal to the floor. This isn't a bad thing as there is no loose pedal between when you put your foot on it, and where it engages.
Overall initial impressions are positive. It feels like it should have no problem holding power but I am going to give it 600-800 miles of break in before I give in any kind of throttle. Currently staying out of boost as much as possible, and no more than 1/4 throttle. Which by the way is torture being on the IE tune! Stay tuned for more updates.

100 mile update: Starting off from a stop has gotten slightly easier and less shuddery. Not sure if this is due to break in or Ive adapted. Still have occasional rough takeoffs and bad shifts into second, though that's more due to me still not used to the high engagement point. Also have had a few instances where shifting out of 1st or 2nd is difficult, but also not sure if that's due to me not pressing the clutch enough or not.

350 mile update: This thing is really starting to feel good! Take offs are getting extremely smooth and clutch pedal effort has either gone down slightly, or I am just getting used to it. Either way, it is definitely becoming more stock like. Had a little mishap today and backed up a steep driveway, which was a mistake. I really slipped the clutch :( It was about 200 miles in to the break in period at that point. I'm hoping I didn't do any damage. Other than that I have really been driving easy, no boost (well not much boost :) Prob under 10psi the 1 or 2 times I'v stepped on it) and have been rev matching every downshift as well as keeping shifting to under 3500 RPM's.

600 mile update: Well I've been driving the car a lot. Mostly city and a little highway. The clutch feels pretty damn near stock as far as engagement goes. The pedal is still firm but has softened up significantly. It is very easy to drive in traffic. So I hit 600 miles today and decided to give it a little gas in third. I would say maybe half throttle right around 3k rpm's. To my dismay the clutch slips. And not just a little either. Just to see, I flashed back stage 1 and tested it and it's solid as a rock with absolutely zero slipping. This kind of sucks haha. I may just get the fx850 and call it a day. I don't want to have to worry about this anymore. Hopefully I can sell this kit to a stage 1 guy or a gti owner. I'm sure it would suit them perfectly. Unfortunately I think IE stage 2 with intake manifold is just a bit too much torque too fast for this setup.

700 mile update: There's just no way this thing holds IE stage 2 power. I have since flashed back to stage 1. Still with the intake manifold. This will only be until I decide what to do next. It holds stage 1 without issue, which is rated at 345WTQ, so that is nice! The only sad thing is that compared to stage 2, stage 1 feels like stock. I can't even imagine how slow a stock R would feel right now lol. And that's without ever even being able to use stage 2 to its full potential. This clutch has awesome feel to it. I'm really going to miss it when I get a new clutch. The drivability is perfect. Having the engagement point high up is definitely awesome. I'll have to get some TOB shims for my next clutch.

1700 mile update:
I have a south end stage 3 daily coming in soon. Hopefully it will be installed at the end of next week. I still think there is no way my current setup shouldn't hold power. I'm fairly positive it is the same exact pressure plate and disc that south end uses in their stage 3 endurance OFE setup. You can find that at 4 seasons tuning. Only difference being I used a new dmf instead of smf. Either way I have a different shop puting this clutch in and they are going to check it all over as they take it out then examine the parts. Hopefully it's a defect and I can get the parts returned or replaced. We'll see.



Southbend Stage 3 Daily ( PN: KFSIF-SS-O)

First day with the Southbend Stage 3 daily:

I picked my car up tonight after getting the southbound stage 3 daily installed. When I first got in and stepped on my clutch I almost put my foot through the firewall. Compared to the Sachs pressure plate the stage 3 is comically light. I see people saying that its way heavier than stock, which really makes me want to feel a stock clutch again, because I don't see how a clutch could feel lighter than the stage 3, at least after driving with the Sachs for a while. I actually preferred the Sachs in that regard. Engagement on the sachs was at the very top of the pedal travel, where as the southbound is right in the middle. Engagement is BUTTER on the southbound, like OMG it is so freaking smooth after driving with the drop-in disc in my last setup, the organic is crazy smooth, just like stock. As for the flywheel, well honestly in my 30 mile trip home, if nobody told me it was any different I wouldn't have known. The one thing I do notice with the single mass is when cruising in gear with a little throttle, then letting off the throttle, theres no jerkiness. The dmf used to have this jerk as when you let off the gas.

The guy at the shop told me that when they pulled my car in, they couldn't believe how heavy the Sachs was. I didn't think it was bad at all, especially after getting used to it. Makes me wonder why people even fuss about these things. Same with the flywheel. Its hardly noticeable unless you're specifically listening for it. The shop looked at my old setup and said it looked like the disc wasn't making full contact with the pressure plate, so my guess is that the disc is just slightly too thin to work with the sachs pressure plate.

All in all i'm satisfied so far. I now have to re-adjust to this new clutch, as well as have no fun for yet again another 800 miles. One concern I do have is tht when i press the clutch pedal to the floor i hear a whining noise. Im going to call southbend about this tomorrow. I fear it is a bad throw out bearing. That woul be just my luck! I'm also going to be so scared to give it any boost once the time comes now haha. Nightmares of slipping clutches. But stay tuned for updates :)

I am going to part out my original setup since everything is practically brand new, and there doesn't appear to be anything wrong with the individual pieces.

Southbend 250 mile update:

I LOVE the way the car drives with this clutch. It's effortless. There seems to be much less lag between the time you touch the gas and the car accelerates. It really makes the car that much more enjoyable to drive. Engagement is still smooth as ever! It is still extremely quiet. I would say no clutch chatter at all. The only time I can hear gear chatter is if my windows are down, and I'm beside a wall or another car, and my music is below volume 7, then I can hear a little. It is really insignificant. I will say I had the stage 2 endurance on my mk6 gti and the gear chatter on that was really loud, so I'm not sure why the R is so quiet, maybe tighter gears, or maybe the stage 3 is just quieter, either way, I have no complaints! As of right now, I would pick this setup over the DMF every time without question.

As for the noise I was hearing when pressing the clutch to the floor, I called southbend. They said either the shop put the disc in backwards, in which case it would be hard to shift (Not the case), or it could be a bad throwout bearing, or the bearing just needs to break in (which I've never heard of). They recommended I finish the break in period and give it some time since it's warrantied for a year. I put a BMW clutch stop in, and removed all spacers so it's literally probably only 1/8" thick, and now I don't get the noise. Hopefully it stays that way.

Southbend 500 mile update:

Hit a little over 500 miles on my way to work this morning. Still love the clutch. Nothing new really from my last post. Have done some driving with the windows down and you can hear some gear chatter on decel in first gear, but it's not enough to bother me. You can also hear it a little at low RPM's when accelerating, again, not enough to bother me, however may bother someone who wants a truly silent clutch. Windows up is barely noticeable if at all. I also flashed my stage 2 tune back on, mostly because the car idled like crap with the intake manifold on the stage 1 tune. I have still been babying the clutch for the most part, driving normal but keeping it below 3-4000 rpm's when possible and really not hitting boost, which is a lot harder with the stage 2 tune lol. I plan to not get on it at all really until 800 miles, then I will ease into it until about 1k, by which time I would hope it is beyond fully broken in.

Southbend 1000 mile update:
Clutch is holding strong. I've been driving it hard since 800 miles. Used no lift shift from 4th-5th AND 5th-6th twice up to 130mph and the clutch took it like a champ. It feels great and chatter is still a non issue. Highly recommended for anybody on the fence.
 

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Subing to track progress. I might post a thread documenting the life of my RR clutch. That would be great if you keep updating this thread as you rack up the miles. :thumbup:
 

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In to see what you think after break in.
My RSR is significantly heavier than stock, yet it still feels stock (just with more pedal feel) -- no issues with smoothness.

I do wish it was a bit cheaper, but eh. I'm happy with it. Curious to see how your setup does.

:)
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Subing to track progress. I might post a thread documenting the life of my RR clutch. That would be great if you keep updating this thread as you rack up the miles. :thumbup:
I def plan too, I think a thread on your RR clutch would be beneficial as well since I only found one other thread on it and that was for a gli.

In to see what you think after break in.
My RSR is significantly heavier than stock, yet it still feels stock (just with more pedal feel) -- no issues with smoothness.

I do wish it was a bit cheaper, but eh. I'm happy with it. Curious to see how your setup does.

:)
Yea mine wasn't cheap at all! It would probably feel stock if it had the organic disc, which would make it much smoother, but it actually engages exactly like my SB stage 2 endurance that I had on my gti.
 

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My stock clutch started slipping with the integrated engineering stage 2 pro intake manifold tune. So the search for a new clutch began. Having had many different cars with many different aftermarket clutches, I know what I was looking for. I wanted a daily able clutch, quiet, street able, and yet something that could hold more power than I'll ever throw at it. Now that last part will only be determined over time, however a month of non stop research has led me to where I am now.

Sachs SRE pressure plate
OEM Sachs DMF
South Bend dxd stage 3 drop in disc

The logic behind this clutch choice is that the Sachs stage 1 & 2 clutch kits for the R use an organic disc and has been proven to hold 500+ ftlbs of torque. However I have also heard of this clutch slipping under very cold temps as well as high load high torque applications. This is a limit of the organic material. Hence where the SB disc comes in. I figured I would bite the bullet on this experiment and hopefully help a few ppl out along the way.

So initial driving impressions:
Picked the car up today. Had the clutch, vwr subframe mount, and Tyrol dead set out installed. This clutch is not for the faint of heart. I've had some heavy clutches in my day, and this is by far the heaviest! I don't mind because I hated the feel of the stock clutch, but this is just a warning up front. Start doing your leg presses!
As for the disc, it feels super grabby, yet forgiving at the same time. With a few more rpm's on take off it can be fairly smooth. There is some shudder that probably can't be avoided, but will possibly smooth out over time.
As for noise, stock! actually since the flywheel is brand slpankin new it is quieter than stock. Absolutely no chatter and no gear noise.
EDIT: Forgot to add, the engagement is literally, the top 5% of pedal travel. This is going to take some getting used to :) I ordered the BMW clutch stop because it feels like I'd put the the throw out bearing through the pressure plate if I put the pedal to the floor. This isn't a bad thing as there is no loose pedal between when you put your foot on it, and where it engages.
Overall initial impressions are positive. It feels like it should have no problem holding power but I am going to give it 600-800 miles of break in before I give in any kind of throttle. Currently staying out of boost as much as possible, and no more than 1/4 throttle. Which by the way is torture being on the IE tune! Stay tuned for more updates.
do you have part numbers for what you ordered?
 

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I never said it was cheap lol. I wanted dmf and a full face disc.

I can see the desire to stick with a DMF. My single mass makes some racket in neutral. Not a deal breaker but you can hear it for sure lol
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I can see the desire to stick with a DMF. My single mass makes some racket in neutral. Not a deal breaker but you can hear it for sure lol
Yea I had the SMF in the gti, and i didn't really mind it, until I test drove the golf R. The first thing I noticed was how much more I liked it without all of the noise haha. And I'm all for "racekar" but the dmv is worlds better, we'll see how it holds up.
 

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Wow, that's pretty surprising. Having driven a full face feramic clutch for 5 or so months at this point, I've noticed some slippage when the disc gets glazed over after a long stretch of too casual driving that burns off pretty easily and returns to holding like hell. Any chance taking it easy during break-in just caused some glazing, or it isn't fully broken in yet?

It seems crazy that the stage 3 drop-in, which should be relatively close to capable of holding stage 2+ torque with the default pressure plate, would slip with the SRE plate.

--Matt
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Wow, that's pretty surprising. Having driven a full face feramic clutch for 5 or so months at this point, I've noticed some slippage when the disc gets glazed over after a long stretch of too casual driving that burns off pretty easily and returns to holding like hell. Any chance taking it easy during break-in just caused some glazing, or it isn't fully broken in yet?

It seems crazy that the stage 3 drop-in, which should be relatively close to capable of holding stage 2+ torque with the default pressure plate, would slip with the SRE plate.

--Matt
I mean it may need more break in time. I have driven it pretty casually so that could be it. I wasn't planning on getting on it for another 150 miles or so but figured half throttle should be ok. I'm going to give it some more time, however I'm not going to baby it now. Just going to drive normal and see if that helps. If not, then idk. I'll be really bummed out. I too would be surprised if this wasn't able to hold the torque. What's the best way to remove any glazing?
 

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Maybe you glazed the disc with that bad clutch slip you mentioned. My stock clutch slips in my car and if I drive it nicely I can get it to stop slipping temporarily. Maybe give it some more time driving normally before attempting to drive aggressive again.
 
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