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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
All,
After much searching on this forum and others, I am going nuts on this one. My rear wiper quit along with both front and rear washers. I checked the fuses (location 41 and 42) and found the fuses good but with no power to them.

The micro switch in the latch is fully functioning , I unplugged it and the hatch open light goes away but still no power.

I checked vag com and there was a code for convenience group or something like that and it says short to ground or open circuit or something like that. I cleared it and still no power to the fuses.

My suspicion is that there is some sort of relay that has gone bad. The dealer (sketchy at best and I live in Raleigh NC) says that there is no relay and the motor and control unit needs to be replaced. 500+ for parts alone.

I have pulled the panels off and have pulled all the connections off of the motor to see if there is corrosion and it looks like the day it was manufactured. Pristine in there so we don't have the classic washer fluid leak issue. There is no residue on the outside of the unit. I pulled the covers off of the wiring loom coming through the body by the hinge and inspected the wires and everything looks perfect.

Has anyone had this issue? I hate to randomly go about replacing relays under the dash as they are a bit pricey. Does anyone have a wiring diagram or a circuit description for the rear wiper or the washer system? I know it is can bus operated so it is very likely that the computer is telling the system to not send power to the fuses but why?
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Maybe the motor?

Daniel is hooking me up with the diagrams. Thanks. I have to ask generally, since this is for the rear motor and both the washers (front and rear); Is there some sort of controller for the rear motor? I have seen the numerous posts for HID's frying the front motor. There is mention of the wiper control unit but I don't know if the rear one has a separate box or if the circuitry in the motor itself is considered a controller.

On a side note, I lost the left rear widow regulator recently and replaced it. Right after that repair, my windows up/down functionality on the key fob went away for a few days but returned magically. I will remember to disconnect the battery the next time I unplug stuff. Could this be related?

I do have Vag Com but am really a rookie when it comes to using it for anything but general scanning but I did manage to program the key to do the window trick.

Anybody have suggestions on where to go next?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Got the diagram, now more confused than ever

Ok,
So the wiring diagram indicates two relays labled Dual washer pump relay1, and Dual washer pump relay 2. They get their power from the control module. Relay 2 feeds the motor, Relay 1 feeds the washer. No fuses are shown in the diagram so I guess the assumption is that they are somewhere after the relays but before the pump/motor. With this in mind, it looks like either the relay(s) are bad or the control module is not sending power to the relays. (I assume that the wiper switch tells the controller to do it's thing). Since the front wipers work properly (even the rain sensing part still works) I am guessing that the switch might be OK. As I mention above, I am rookie with my VAG COM but am welcome for input on what to try next. Please be ridiculously simple with instructions as "check the function of the whirlygig with your VAG COM" will not be very useful. Thanks.

Also, is there a way to cross reference the relays in the diagram that are labled J729 and J730 with a part number?
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Identifed the correct relay but where is it in the relay panel?

After doing some more research, I found a single relay that feeds fuses 41 and 42 ( the fuses are labeled: Dual washer pump relay 1 and 2). Fuse 41 feeds the washer, fuse 42 feeds the rear wiper. The relay in question is labeled Load Reduction relay(on the diagram) an it's only function is to feed the above two fuses and relays. So I have identified the name of the relay but the problem is I do not know how to identify specifically which one it is in the relay panel. The wiring diagram indicates it is J59 but I do not have a diagram of the relay panel to know which one it is.

Massive thanks to Daniel Ramirez for getting me the diagrams. He is truly a credit to the forum.

Anybody been down this road before and maybe has a diagram and or the part number for this "load reduction" relay? I tested the output with VAG COM and just like the switch, there is no rear wiper or washer function but with no power to the fuses, this is not surprising.

Anybody?
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Pic

Thanks for the link.

That diagram doesn't resemble the panel where J59 is on my car. The panel where I think it is, is a rectangular panel with only one row of relays mounted horizontally. Doing other research it appears that J59 also has "460" printed on the top. The part number that the dealer says it is, is 1K0951253A. They of course did not have it in stock and have ordered it. Should be here tomorrow. What cross reference did you use to determine it was item 5?

Just as an editorial comment not directed at anyone here: What brain surgeon decided that a repair manual would not reference relay locations by number in an index? It would seem that "J59" would show up in an index and then give a page number with a diagram of the relay panel with, you guessed it, "J59" shown on a picture. WTF?

What this saga has taught me is that if there is no power to a fuse panel location, trace a wiring diagram until you find the fuse location in question and then see what feeds it. The dealer literally told me that the rear wiper and washer was not controlled by a relay. Obviously, not only is there a relay in the circuit, the entire mess has a "load reduction relay" upstream that cuts power to these items when starting the car. Those dealership people scare me...
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Thanks again

DutchcaribbeanGTI,
I really appreciate your help. I take it elsawin is the factory lookup system or something? I will have the dash panel out tomorrow if the part gets here and give it a try. (yes, that looks more like what I saw when I had the dash panel down a few days ago) Again, I have to ask, how do you know that location 4 is where relay J59 is supposed to go? This is like playing a game without knowing what the rules are... Clearly, "we" are ahead of my local dealership in terms of analyzing a problem, but what sort of manual, cross reference or document do I need to have in order to locate a friggin relay?

ABC or Leeward island? Must be tough the get parts in a hurry over there.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Problem Solved

Thanks to Daniel, CarribbeanGTI and the forum in general, the issue has been solved. The new relay did the trick. As the wiring diagram pointed out, the ECM feeds the load reduction relay that temporarily cuts power to fuse location 41 (the washer circuit) and fuse 42 (the rear wiper circuit) when the key is turned (or when the relay is bad...). For reference if someone searches rear wiper fuse or something like it, the Relay involved is
Part number :1K0951253A
It has large block numbers on the outside: 460
It's location is in the relay panel under the steering column (left drive) and is right most and lowest most socket placement (wide right on the bottom).
Crappy photo of the relay panel is below
http://s936.photobucket.com/user/cnyman_photos/library/audi pics

I paid 13.56US for the relay that should have sold for 8 or 10 bucks but they got it in 24 hours so I didn't mind too much.
 

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Problem Solved

Thanks to Daniel, CarribbeanGTI and the forum in general, the issue has been solved. The new relay did the trick. As the wiring diagram pointed out, the ECM feeds the load reduction relay that temporarily cuts power to fuse location 41 (the washer circuit) and fuse 42 (the rear wiper circuit) when the key is turned (or when the relay is bad...). For reference if someone searches rear wiper fuse or something like it, the Relay involved is
Part number :1K0951253A
It has large block numbers on the outside: 460
It's location is in the relay panel under the steering column (left drive) and is right most and lowest most socket placement (wide right on the bottom).
Crappy photo of the relay panel is below
http://s936.photobucket.com/user/cnyman_photos/library/audi pics

I paid 13.56US for the relay that should have sold for 8 or 10 bucks but they got it in 24 hours so I didn't mind too much.
Hi.
Thank you! Major help! Just got mine fixed after 6 months of guessing.
 
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