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Battle For The Hatchback Replacement

  • Audi Q3

    Votes: 1 1.6%
  • Audi SQ5

    Votes: 7 11.1%
  • Audi S5 Sportback

    Votes: 12 19.0%
  • Porsche Macan S

    Votes: 9 14.3%
  • VW GTI

    Votes: 15 23.8%
  • VW Golf R

    Votes: 15 23.8%
  • Other

    Votes: 9 14.3%
  • None Of The Above

    Votes: 7 11.1%
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Given the small difference in price btw a equally loaded GTI and Golf R, it does not make sense to get a GTI unless you dont care for leather and really want a sunroof.

The only two non SUV options for me are C43 or R.
That "small" price difference isn't really small at all once the real world sets in. You'll get a couple of grand off an R and end up somewhere in the high 30s. Conversely, you'll get way more off a similarly-optioned GTI. A $34k SE can easily end up being $27k. That's a $10k delta. As an example of what non-Rs actually go for down here (and Canadialand may be different), I negotiated a 35th Anniversary Jetta GLI deal yesterday for my cousin. $28,XXX MSRP car for $22.5k, and it took almost no work for that more-than-$6k discount.
 

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Discussion Starter #23
Depends on snow - if you're in snowbelt/Canada, get the R with dsg - if Florida then N or GTI probably.

I wouldn't go back to FWD even with studded snows, but in the summer I can't tell driving normally.
Not in Canada but I am in the northeast US - we had ice/freezing rain yesterday and today freezing rain or snow. Its early for us, we usually dont see it till mid to late December or January. I have done ok with FWD but AWD or 4WD is better obviously.

Would prefer something that does great in bad weather which is why I want AWD. Quattro is obviously a known thing as is a Jeep of course.
 

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That "small" price difference isn't really small at all once the real world sets in. You'll get a couple of grand off an R and end up somewhere in the high 30s. Conversely, you'll get way more off a similarly-optioned GTI. A $34k SE can easily end up being $27k. That's a $10k delta. As an example of what non-Rs actually go for down here (and Canadialand may be different), I negotiated a 35th Anniversary Jetta GLI deal yesterday for my cousin. $28,XXX MSRP car for $22.5k, and it took almost no work for that more-than-$6k discount.
MSRP is about $5k difference for 70 hp and AWD. With our climate, its worth it for the AWD. I'm sure GTI are discounted more as I rarely see them but I see lots of R's. And since we dont have traffic all day, you can enjoy those 70 extra hp! ;)
 

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Not in Canada but I am in the northeast US - we had ice/freezing rain yesterday and today freezing rain or snow. Its early for us, we usually dont see it till mid to late December or January. I have done ok with FWD but AWD or 4WD is better obviously.

Would prefer something that does great in bad weather which is why I want AWD. Quattro is obviously a known thing as is a Jeep of course.
I went with winter tires. Try it.
 

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I have done it in the past and they work. Thats for dam sure.

Winter and AWD is not the primary driver for me looking.
I was looking at used 911's (997.2) but with 2 kids I couldn't make the practicality work. I like the S4 but it's a bit big. S3/Golf R - I liked the dash on the S3 best but for 10K less I got a hatch with no Audi badge. No regrets, it's a boatload of fun in the winter, even more than the STI and Focus RS I drove back to back. The R power oversteers in snow effortlessly (for fun) - even with the TC/ESP just in sport mode which I didn't think was possible (max 50% rear). Oh, and JB4. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #30
I was looking at used 911's (997.2) but with 2 kids I couldn't make the practicality work. I like the S4 but it's a bit big. S3/Golf R - I liked the dash on the S3 best but for 10K less I got a hatch with no Audi badge. No regrets, it's a boatload of fun in the winter, even more than the STI and Focus RS I drove back to back. The R power oversteers in snow effortlessly (for fun) - even with the TC/ESP just in sport mode which I didn't think was possible (max 50% rear). Oh, and JB4. :)
I have come close to buy a Porsche (911 and Boxster) multiple times. What has always held me back is the lack of practicality. I don't have kids but am always carrying something be it stuff or people.

Unfortunately for me I am extremely practical about big $ purchases. I can't just say - do it, you only live once. I was poor growing up and have done well for myself but it has made me too conscious I guess. I will spend but only after much justification, LOL.

I was impressed with the R when I drove it. I liked it better than the Audi for the simple fact is that it has a hatch. Yes the Audi is put together better but no hatch is a deal breaker for me.

What is JB4?
 

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I have come close to buy a Porsche (911 and Boxster) multiple times. What has always held me back is the lack of practicality. I don't have kids but am always carrying something be it stuff or people.

Unfortunately for me I am extremely practical about big $ purchases. I can't just say - do it, you only live once. I was poor growing up and have done well for myself but it has made me too conscious I guess. I will spend but only after much justification, LOL.

I was impressed with the R when I drove it. I liked it better than the Audi for the simple fact is that it has a hatch. Yes the Audi is put together better but no hatch is a deal breaker for me.

What is JB4?
https://burgertuning.com/products/jb1-jb4-group-1-vag-tuner

Completely removable piggy back, good for 30-40 hp/tq on 91.

Spare tire kit for ~300 also required for most people. It's factory just doesn't come included. So dumb, but whatever. That was another problem with the 911 - even with the boxter spare you couldn't physically put the rear wheel in the back unless you had a targa.
 

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Discussion Starter #33
https://burgertuning.com/products/jb1-jb4-group-1-vag-tuner

Completely removable piggy back, good for 30-40 hp/tq on 91.

Spare tire kit for ~300 also required for most people. It's factory just doesn't come included. So dumb, but whatever. That was another problem with the 911 - even with the boxter spare you couldn't physically put the rear wheel in the back unless you had a targa.
Thats interesting about the piggy back.

I did see the lack of spare tire on the R - what the heck were they thinking? Porsches (accept for the Macan, Cayenne and Panamera) have not had them for a long time now. Ironically I saw a few weeks ago that Kias are not coming with a spare now either.

The nonsense they are shoveling is that its to save weight. Really?
 

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No love for the performance car of the year? Hyundai Veloster N


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I second that opinion.

Hyundai basically exposed the GTI for it's lack of power and meh handling. Sure, I don't disagree it's not a driver's car, but VW has purposefully kept it neutered for years. Then along comes the Veloster N and makes the GTI look weak and pathetic for a $30K+ "hot hatch." The only thing the the GTI has going for it is its interior. It certainly is now outgunned coupled with a long history of engine and emissions issues and horrendous dealership support. It's resting on it's laurels (I owned a Jetta Wolfsburg. I have first hand knowledge of the 2.0T's failings and never ending CELs. Maybe it's better these days but when you buy a CPO VW and you get a CEL before you even make it to your driveway...with only 29K miles on the car...makes you want to reach for the Pepto Bismol). Didn't we just have a forum member buy a new GTI with a ripped seat??? How does that happen? The pleather seats in my Jetta were indestructible.

Flame on. I don't care. I was a VW owner so you're not going to convince me otherwise. The Veloster N is the new VW GTI, minus the interior. But who cares? They put the money into things that an enthusiast really cares about.

To each his own.
 

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A5/S5 SB is the first truly beautiful Audi in a long time. Voted for it just for that alone.

What exactly do you need a hatchback for? Earlier this year we did a road trip with a toddler in my TLX. It was fine
 

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I second that opinion.

Hyundai basically exposed the GTI for it's lack of power and meh handling. Sure, I don't disagree it's not a driver's car, but VW has purposefully kept it neutered for years. Then along comes the Veloster N and makes the GTI look weak and pathetic for a $30K+ "hot hatch." The only thing the the GTI has going for it is its interior. It certainly is now outgunned coupled with a long history of engine and emissions issues and horrendous dealership support. It's resting on it's laurels (I owned a Jetta Wolfsburg. I have first hand knowledge of the 2.0T's failings and never ending CELs. Maybe it's better these days but when you buy a CPO VW and you get a CEL before you even make it to your driveway...with only 29K miles on the car...makes you want to reach for the Pepto Bismol). Didn't we just have a forum member buy a new GTI with a ripped seat??? How does that happen? The pleather seats in my Jetta were indestructible.

Flame on. I don't care. I was a VW owner so you're not going to convince me otherwise. The Veloster N is the new VW GTI, minus the interior. But who cares? They put the money into things that an enthusiast really cares about.

To each his own.
Look at the list, do you think a VN is going to have the creature comforts that the rest of these cars come equipped with? I own one and it is a step down in interior materials compared to the rest of this list, the fit is very good but the materials are cheap. (i.e. hard plastic everywhere)

I voted Golf R, seems to meet your requirements the best. I do, however, suggest driving the VN. It's a seriously fun car.
 

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Depends on snow - if you're in snowbelt/Canada, get the R with dsg
Interesting. Based on personal preference I would always prefer manual vs. DSG in the snow

One thing to recommend the R...the leg room is very good given the size of the car (coming from a long-legged 6'5" guy)

Maybe not the best choice if some of your activity priorities are hauling many people that are larger-than-average size

Also speaking from the AARP Lounge.....
- Much lower access vs. CUVs. My artificial knees don't always love this. Also, if you have kids in car seats, CUVs easier to access
- As you age, your eyes get worse.....in the ongoing "make new cars with ever-brighter headlights" wars, driving a lower elevation hatch (vs. CUV) at night can make you feel like your retinas are getting seared out by the now-majority CUVs/SUVs whose beams are hitting you at eye level
 

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Khyron said:
Depends on snow - if you're in snowbelt/Canada, get the R with dsg
Interesting. Based on personal preference I would always prefer manual vs. DSG in the snow
Not trying to argue (you even said personal preference!); but I honestly don't understand the reason for a transmission preference either way when it comes to snow? I've never found either to have an observable advantage over the other, unlike tires, driven wheels, weight distribution, clearance, etc, which are very apparent to me and I have strong preferences on.
 

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Not trying to argue (you even said personal preference!); but I honestly don't understand the reason for a transmission preference either way when it comes to snow? I've never found either to have an observable advantage over the other, unlike tires, driven wheels, weight distribution, clearance, etc, which are very apparent to me and I have strong preferences on.
I guess in my case it is what I am used to...and I feel manual gives me a slightly better feel of traction/lack there-of and overall control of the car. That said, if I had 7 years of experience driving a MKVII DSG in the snow, I am sure I'd be more in tune with that set-up :cool:. We have a hill-climb dirt driveway. I feel more confident in my R with my new Nokian Hakkepelita R3s than my wife's 4Runner (as long as the snow isn't deep)...but again, based on both familarity and more micro-control vs. burly, plow ahead, truck-like SUV.
 
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