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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
some of you have helped me before with other threads but here's what I gathered from testing my dpr tonight. Can you guy's help me disect the results and give me an idea of what I should be ranging.
Had to make a couple small adjustments to the mixture to get the car to run steadily at first... seemed like it wanted to be more rich than lean. Thinking I may need to swap my coolant temp sensor because it definitely didn't want to idle until it heated up to normal operating temp.
Plugged in the test harness and got a reading bouncing from 10-14
but found that the engine sounded like it was running best when adjusted to a range of:
6.0 - 9.4 bouncing <----good/bad?
When I leaned it out the numbers spiked to 19.9 this was with a very small adjustment!!!! Plus I gave it a minute to recaliberate but it stayed at 19.9 - turned it back to rich and it registered again. I thought it may have needed to run a bit more lean but maybe I'm wrong... seems like I'm getting a bit of smokey fuel out of the exhuast.
What should my readings be??? Specs - lightend engine internals and flywheel etc., engine made to see high rpms, slightly higher cr., pnp, header, 268 cams, enrichment module, some other odds and ends. Nothing extreme but it is made to run very hard and high rpms. Mixture range should be ?mA?
Also how can I teat my coolant temp sensor??? Haven't looked in my bentely, any heads up? I am thinking that it's the cause of my bad idle on startup and maybe some of my other issues. That's one thing I never replaced on the car and would make sense. The ISV is working 100%, o2 sensor 100%, and dpr reads fine... thinking I need to replace it. Thoughts???

No need to read the below threads unless you want to get up-to-date on the issues, symptoms, and tests that have been completed.
PREVIOUS THREADS RE: trouble shooting etc.
firing on 2 cylinders http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2767804
o2 sensor 16v tech forum http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2760864
vw special tool sledge upside my car http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2747091
fuel distributor go bad? http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2676528




Modified by BubbleBLOCK at 3:14 AM 8-19-2006
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Re: Tested my DPR tonight *** results inside (BubbleBLOCK)

a bit confused here because so many of you told me to test the dpr reading and now there's no follow up to the test results? Are my results good or bad???

what should they be reading?
 

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Re: Tested my DPR tonight *** results inside (BubbleBLOCK)

looked this up for you
http://members.dslextreme.com/....html

Quote »
The reading should only fluctuate about 2-3 milliamps, for example, the stock setting for a 1.8 16V is 5mA. This means the meter should be jumping between approximately 4 and 6mA, averaging 5mA.
Next thing to remember: the higher the number, the leaner your car is running. The lower the number, the richer the car is running."

Quote »
Turning the mixture screw clockwise will RICHEN the mixture, and of course turning it counterclockwise will lean it out. Never turn the screw more than an 1/8th of a turn at a time. You will see that it is very sensitive."


Quote »
Stock settings:
1.8 16V-averaging 5mA.
1.8 8V-averaging 10mA
2.0 16V motronic-averaging 2.5mA."


Quote »
Performance Tuning
1.8 16V-averaging 3-4mA ("bouncing" off of 2.5mA)
1.8 8V-averaging 9mA ("bouncing" off of 8mA)
2.0 16V with CIS-E averaging 3mA ("bouncing" off of 2mA)
2.0 16V motronic - get a performance chip!

hope that helps, seems like you have a good adjustment, perhaps a little lean
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Re: Tested my DPR tonight *** results inside (4)

Quote, originally posted by 4 »
looked this up for you
http://members.dslextreme.com/....html
hope that helps, seems like you have a good adjustment, perhaps a little lean


thanks kyle......
i had read a lot of info about testing the dpr and that's some of what I had read, however I heard mixed remarks about Rich/Lean... and since I'm running a 1.8cise on a 2.0 16v i had heard I want to run a little more lean than rich... just what i've heard - not first hand experience. Tomorrow I plan to spend the entire day testing different settings and logging each test. I will richen the mixture up to get a 2-5 reading and see what comes of it...
I still think I may have a bad coolent temp sensor... idle upon warm up is not steady etc etc.
...anyone have some experience with the DPR and mixture to give me some ideas on maybe where I should be with my setup? I will try what the bentely say's and what I have read (what kyle posted) also....
 

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Re: Tested my DPR tonight *** results inside (A2notMKII)

sorry, cant help you anymore, but right around 5 ~ should be running well
i am running a 1.8 16v on 1.8 8v cis-e, mixed up as well, i need to mess with those settings but i couldnt get a raeding from my voltmeter, it has too mahy settings
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Re: Tested my DPR tonight *** results inside (4)

Quote, originally posted by 4 »
sorry, cant help you anymore, but right around 5 ~ should be running well
i am running a 1.8 16v on 1.8 8v cis-e, mixed up as well, i need to mess with those settings but i couldnt get a raeding from my voltmeter, it has too mahy settings

yeah i feel ya... i am definitely not an electronic guy but I do own a multimeter to pretend like I know what I'm doing... it only took me a couple day's to realize why my harness wasn't working and it was because I had the meter on the wrong setting ugh! I'm not completely clueless I swear!
I will try that setting tomorrow and run the car to see what happens.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Re: (86vwgti8v)

Quote, originally posted by 86vwgti8v »
interested in the results.
im not running the same set up you.
but running cis-e im learning the importance of it being set correctly.

we can learn together... my one friend swears by tuning cise mixture. Everything I've read, in the bentley for example, states it's preset from the factory and should never need adjusting. But the whacky thing is the bentley then contradicts itself by telling you how to test it etc etc.
I'm going to reread the fuel injection section because iirc the bentley discusses what the results should be and more.
any other experience on the subject??? I had a problem with fowling plugs (most of the time wet) so why would I want it more RICH?
Also, if I'm currently reading a low of 6 up to a high of 9.4 that's a bigger spread than what the text say's... is that a problem, can I adjust that? It's not constantly bouncing off those numbers, they are just the low and high that I saw during the test.
 

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Re: (86vwgti8v)

The wide range of ma bouncing you see is probably caused by a slowed up 02 sensor reaction time caused by slight fouling from previously running too rich.......
I'd take it for a hard ride while watching your mixture meter. Youd want it in closed loop until you hit full throttle above 2500 rpms. Then it should be nice & rich. If you're off the scales then I'd remove the enrichment module & try it without it. The mixture setting at idle doesnt matter much(as long as its bouncing somewhat), its at heavy throttle when it matters & thats what you're really adjusting for. Basically if the ma is bouncing at idle, its in closed loop & the system is somewhat within operating spec. At full throttle above 2500 rpms its running off the mechanical adjustments that you made. Adjust this all right after you drove the car hard & its fully warmed up, it will be most accurate this way..... I have a feeling you dont have a fuel mixture gauge, so you could just for a tiny bit of insight, have your ma meter hooked at idle & then take the 3mm adjusting wrench & use it to hold the throttle open so its a fixed amount without closing the idle switch. Look at your ma reading & it should still be in closed loop. I doubt that little step will help you depending on your situation...... Test the coolant sensor via bentley resistance(it's easy) and do it a couple times at different temps as the engine warms up. After all this & your car still has a bad idle warming up then you should make sure the airflow plate adjustments are on point. Test that black thing on the other side of the plate setup(with 3 wires) as a last resort, only if your cold engine response sucks. It could be possible that its so far out of spec that it interferes with the cold idle. You could put the ma meter on from initial startup but that would just show the default warmup current of like 10ma(after the large initial start currents for under a minute) until it warmed up enough to hit closed loop.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Re: (elementsoffury)

thanks for the info... I just tested it again and made some small adjustments. I adjusted it more RICH to a 2.0/2.5 - 5/6 +/- bouncing of course. Took it for a drive and it seemed doggish and didn't seem any more powerful on high rpms...
while I was testing, I clicked the WOT switch and it read 13.2 - is this normal??? I do have an enrichment module hooked up.
What should OE readings be at WOT and ofcourse what should it read with the module????
My brother has a co2 gauge that we're going to throw in the exhuast to get a reading there. The does idle once it's completely warmed up but prior to that it runs like complete SHART!
On another note I am still blowing serious smoke and now I'm concerned that maybe I'm blowing coolant. I thought it was fuel before, now I'm changing my diagnosis. I'm going to have to pull the intake, and crap and check the torque on the head. ugh!
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Re: (BubbleBLOCK)

just read most of the fuel injection section of the bentley and it's telling me on pages 73 and 74 i want an average of 2.5+/- mA on a 9a however with a PL 10-1mA fluctuating. So should I have mine adjusted even lower than what I'm reading or should I lean the sucker out?!??!??
going to go to the store and when I get back I'm going to check the coolant temp sensor and enrichment... saw the tests in that same section of the bentley.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Re: Tested my DPR tonight *** results inside (BubbleBLOCK)

NEW RESULTS...
I tested my coolant temp sensor and it appears as though it's working just fine. It read 1100+ and the engine was warm to the touch so I'm assuming around 100F+. The car sat the better part of 2 hours since I ran it this afternoon till it was nice and hot.
Tested again after the car reached operating temp. and got a reading of 200+ assuming the engine was 170F+.
So looks like the coolant temp sensor is working so I still don't know why - when the engine is COLD and I start it, it runs like shart, revs up and down quite iradically.
.
.
.
I checked to see whether my cold start enrichment was where it should be - it was. I got a reading of 87mA+/- when key was turned - got a reading of 145mA with about a 45 second delay till it dropped to 87mA again. Seems right on the money.
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.
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Tested to see if my enrichment was working properly - unplugged my enrichment module to get an OE reading... operating temp was reached, rpms at 2500, and got a reading of 14.7mA
Tested with the enrichment module connected, and got a reading of 19.47mA - so all this seemed right on the money also!!
Any of that seem out of place???? From what the bentley stated and everything I've heard and read it seems like it's all in line. I just can't figure out why I'm not running good from cold start - the car needs to reach operating temp before it's happy...
Thoughts?


and I'll be dipped in **** I think I need to swap the head gasket or something because I'm smoking bad when there's a load. If it's still and rev'ed not really any smoke, but the moment I hit the street for testing I lay down a smog that puts spy hunter to shame!! Seriously I made cars stop today cause they couldn't see hahahahah!
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Re: Tested my DPR tonight *** results inside (elementsoffury)

Quote, originally posted by elementsoffury »
That all seems well in order so you should be running fine.
When cold can you get it run smooth by adjusting the idle or fuel mixture? One of those should be able to do it.

if I dick with the fuel mixture I can get it to run right during cold idle... but that's no good because then it will whackout my mixture for WOT.
I think I have a bad head gasket and coolant is wetting out the cylinders or something. Gonna pull the head tonight when I get home from work.
 
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