twincharged, oh yeah, where can i find more info.

Re: twincharged, oh yeah, where can i find more info. (turboveedub90)

John betz (forced induction guru) of Bahn Brenner has a lyshome super and a turbo on his raddo, and when asked agout performance he was speachless! but as far as a kit goes i have no idea if he sells one or not i just know whats on hes corrado

Re: twincharged, oh yeah, where can i find more info. (turboveedub90)

I'm going to do this mod but listen to the reasoning before you all go off the deep end with me. First letts say the turbo and the G60 are both 60% efficant, .6x.6=.36, so that brings your efficanty down to less than 40%. Heat is going to be the main problem, think of 110 degree heat going into your G60, whats going to come out is going to get close to boiling water! So the need for very large IC's will be needed. Notice I said IC's, as one inbetween the turbo and G60 will be needed if your going to keep the efficanty up. And after the G60 a very large IC will be a nessity if your not going to melt pistons unless you run a CR of 7:1 or less. So if your willing, letts look at what kind of PSI your looking at, say your running 9psi out the turbo and a stock G60 with a normal psi of 9. Is that 9x9=81psi? Well no but letts just say that we might know why someone might be speachless, 81psi x 200 degree heat (OUCH) Well what are the limiting factors? Because we all know your not going to get 81psi. And that is the amount of CFM the turbo flows and the efficanty of the boost. So letts say that the intake charge of the G60 after the IC is down to 7psi and 85 degrees. the G60 will not x9 the charge, because the efficanty of the G60 will be lower because of the temp of the charge but even if the G60 x4 the charge the result is 7x4=28! I think it might be higher but the temp is now up to 150 degrees, and after the second IC down to 25psi and 100 degrees. Allmost like running a T3 with no IC. Not so good. So you see why no one makes a kit Now why would I say I'm going to do this mad thing Because I think it's possible to use a turbo that spools early to up the PSI of a stock G60 at low RPM's yet controls the amount of boost in the upper RPM's to a more manageable level so that heat isn't melting everything. I have everything to do this mad thing for less than $400 Wish me luck

Re: twincharged, oh yeah, where can i find more info. (junkyardpirelligolf)

.36 efficiant sounds about right.Sometimes more is less

Re: twincharged, oh yeah, where can i find more info. (psi)

How did I know (toilet bowl scrubber) would have something to say Now really, if you tie the boost control of a K26 into the intake you should have full boost by 2000rpm's (20+psi) without paying $2600 bucks for an RSR charger but like I said the heat at higher rpm's will hurt your performance (the efficanty drops). So the G60 should put out more psi at higher rpm's and the turbo less. I'll bet that when BBM put that motor together and the moment the turbo spooled the motor melted. A TO3 is way to big for that app.

Re: twincharged, oh yeah, where can i find more info. (junkyardpirelligolf)

all i have to say is WOW

Re: twincharged, oh yeah, where can i find more info. (junkyardpirelligolf)

There have been a few twincharger setups in the past. What comes to mind is an HKS kit for the 88-89 Supercharged MR-2 apparantly there was only 6 sold in North America it was freakin' expensive! It used a clutch that disengaged the S/C once the turbo got on boil from a pressure sensitive switch. The other car that comes to mind is the Gruppe 'B' Rally car the Lancia Delta S4 the best car to never win the world championship as they banned the Group B cars after a series of accidents causing loss of life in the S4's maiden season. Here is a schematic of the Delta S4's turbo/SC setup looks like a plumbers nightmare eh?!?!

Re: twincharged, oh yeah, where can i find more info. (vwdriver92)

hey guys ...
how about this ...
Air filter -> SC -> IC -> BOV -> T3/T4 -> IC -> BOV ->Intake ....
i would love to see anyone runnin this setup ...

Re: twincharged, oh yeah, where can i find more info. (VW_Adrian)

The only way I see this feasible for anyone to get running well in thier garage is running a setup similar to the origional S4. If I were to undertake such a project, I'd pick a nice fat turbo, one which wouldn't make good boost till about 4500 rpms. At this predetermined rpm setting, the supercharger would be disengaged from the serpintine belt (on a setup similar to an A/C clutch), and the turbo would be free to boost its heart out. If set up properly, it would have the benifits of a supercharger (off the line torque, instant spool up) plus the good stuff from a big turbo without the lag.
You could run them on totally different plumbing, each with thier own intercooler, or share a larger intercooler. If sharing, however, I'd imagine some type of 2 - 1 fitting with a one way valve would be needed prior to the IC. Otherwise, boost would be blown back out through the supercharger while on the turbo boost. Sounds like a fun project for someone with the time and cash...
Air filter ---> Supercharger ----------------> BOV --------> Intake manifold
Air filter ---> Turbo ----------------^

hehe, I said turbo boost.



[Modified by sirhcorrado, 9:42 PM 11-25-2001]

Re: twincharged, oh yeah, where can i find more info. (sirhcorrado)

Well I don't understand why it would be better to have the G60 first. The turbo should spool just fine first as long as theres a BOV. I think go go green golf said it would be silly to think running a turbo into a SC would double the thermal load. I hope he misspoke cause %36 efficanty causes a lot of heat. BTW a roots blower is %40 efficant, you know like the ones they use on top fuel dragsters !! Just give this a thought, a small turbo will spool early, the G60 puts out more boost at higher rpm's. The effect I'm looking for is the same boost at all rpm's, not so much boost that the motor needs forged, cryo, nitrited,and shoot peened everything I am not rich SO lets look at a T26 feeding a new G60. At low rpm's the turbo is spooled and and is at peak efficanty but the G60 isn't putting out much boost and there for not much secondary heat. At higher rpm's the G60 is putting out the majority of the boost so the turbo backs off and therefor less heat. Because the turbo is small it would put out a lot off heat, trying to put out a lot of boost at higher rpm's, but like I said the turbo doesn't need to because the G60 is putting out the majority of the boost So lets take a look at the plans for my project I have a golf1 with cowl induction(metal is welded at the sides). 2" lift at the back of the hood. I'm going to take the raintray out to make room for the stock IC (passat) and also mount a starion IC with two radiator fans drawing air in and blowing down at the turbo (TD manifold mounted up side down). The T26 turbo feeds the stock IC then comes over the motor (hood is lifted) feeds the G60 goes back over the motor to the starion IC into a BOV right by the throddle. the total lenth of tubing should be less than the stock passat Any one want to try to figure out the best way to deal with the bypass valve

Re: twincharged, oh yeah, where can i find more info. (junkyardpirelligolf)

Have you ever driven a G60? I have problems with traction in my corrado, which weighs a whole bunch more than a MK1. The only way a turbo would help the situation is if it was utilized in the upper power band, when parasite drag starts to take its toll on the supercharger.

Re: twincharged, oh yeah, where can i find more info. (sirhcorrado)

I allready have a problem with traction in 1st, 2nd and 3rd. Breaks loose if I put the hammer down to fast. But I'm going to a 3.67 RP and a .71 5th in with the G60. I figure I need about 220whp to do 160mph. The golf1 is a brick. Had it up to 130mph (downhill). God I love the autobahn

Re: twincharged, oh yeah, where can i find more info. (junkyardpirelligolf)

all i have to say is this:
You guys are all insane.

Re: twincharged, oh yeah, where can i find more info. (junkyardpirelligolf)

You seem to be contradicting yourself...

I've got a worked stage IV G60, and theres no way I'm close to 220wph... probably closer to 170 whp. I don't see how a small turbo will give you another 50wph on the top end of your powerband (where you will need it to hit your top speed).

Re: twincharged, oh yeah, where can i find more info. (sirhcorrado)

i thought you guys might want to see this ...its a g60 engine with a lysholm supercharger and a t3 super60 turbo its using the stock intercooler and a laminova air/water intercooler