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What my VW dealer told me about chipping.

1955 Views 39 Replies 31 Participants Last post by  kyokoris
Listen I walked into my VW dealership asking about what breaks warrenty
blah blah then he said that chipping breaks it because it changes everything. Sorry to sound dumb whats "everything" I mean if I do this without them knowing
how can they ever find out? Unless I bring it in with some weird out of wack problem where they have to diag the car right?
I need some help.
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Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (2002GTIVR6)

APR makes a chip with different settings (stock, performance, etc) that is controlled by the cruise control buttons on the turn signal stalk. You could set it to stock if you are going into the shop, or if you are going to give your car to a valet (never
). Unless they take apart the ECU, they cant tell.
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Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (vr6Cop)

quote:[HR][/HR]APR makes a chip with different settings (stock, performance, etc) that is controlled by the cruise control buttons on the turn signal stalk. You could set it to stock if you are going into the shop, or if you are going to give your car to a valet (never
). Unless they take apart the ECU, they cant tell.
[HR][/HR]​
Unless you over-rev and the ECU throws an over-rev code.
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Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (2002GTIVR6)

I have GIAC. Installed at 5K. It's been awesome. No way to tell I have chip until you hit the gas pedal. Idle cruise all the same. Car runs a lot smother. SInce then car has been in twice for air bag fault. They fixed under warranty. Dealer told me as long as the chip does not stop them from diagnostics test, they see no roblem. Every dealer is different. My .02 cents. Exhaust is a nice mod two.
Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (2002GTIVR6)

quote:[HR][/HR]Listen I walked into my VW dealership asking about what breaks warrenty
blah blah then he said that chipping breaks it because it changes everything. Sorry to sound dumb whats "everything" I mean if I do this without them knowing
how can they ever find out? Unless I bring it in with some weird out of wack problem where they have to diag the car right?
I need some help.
[HR][/HR]​

Wow. That was the absolute dumbest thing you could have done. Now every single time you bring the car in with a problem, they will expect that you got chipped, and check for one. The only way anything can ever void a warranty is if it directly causes a problem you are having.
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Just ask your dealer if he ever heard of Magnassun vs. Moss. It's some landmark case that says a dealer must prove a direct relationship between your aftermarket part and whatever the problem is that they try to deny warranty service for.
Anyway, that's what someone here on the Vortex said so take it for what it's worth.
Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (truckasaurus)

I knew my State and Local Gov't class would come in handy eventually!!!
Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (2002GTIVR6)

I don't know what he considers "everthing" to be, but if he's referring to the 100k/10yr powertrain warranty, he's correct (at least with 2000 cars). Read the separate description of the powertrain warranty in detail. It says if you change the engine controls (i.e., chip) you void the warranty.
EDIT: Oh, anyone who tells you they'll never find out can pay your repair bill for you. It takes 5 minutes to remove the ECU and physically see that the seal has been broken. That's how they tell you've chipped.


[Modified by JettaRed, 5:08 PM 2-11-2002]
Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (BostonMk4)

quote:[HR][/HR]
Unless you over-rev and the ECU throws an over-rev code.[HR][/HR]​
APR chip removes those codes too
Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (truckasaurus)

quote:[HR][/HR]Just ask your dealer if he ever heard of Magnassun vs. Moss. It's some landmark case that says a dealer must prove a direct relationship between your aftermarket part and whatever the problem is that they try to deny warranty service for.
Anyway, that's what someone here on the Vortex said so take it for what it's worth.[HR][/HR]​
If you think the Magnuson-Moss Act (not Magnassun vs. Moss) is absolute protection, be prepared to give lawyers lots of money to prove your case. VW tells you specifically not to do something (forewarning) and you do it and something breaks (whether it was a direct result of what you did or not). You are going to spend more money in court trying to prove you're right than the probable cost of repairs.
If I was on the jury, I'd find in favor of the defendant. Maytag says "don't touch a hot burner on the stove." You do and sue because you burnt yourself. LOL, you better hope I'm not on the jury.

quote:[HR][/HR]The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act (15 U.S.C. 2302(C))
This federal law regulates warranties for the protection of consumers. The essence of this law concerning aftermarket auto parts is that a vehicle manufacturer may not condition a written or implied warranty on the consumers using parts or services which are identified by brand, trade, or corporate name (such as the vehicle makers brand) unless the parts or service are provided free of charge. The law means that the use of an aftermarket part alone is not cause for denying the warranty. However, the law's protection does not extend to aftermarket parts in situations where such parts actually caused the damage being claimed under the warranty. Further, consumers are advised to be aware of any specific terms or conditions stated in the warranty which may result in its being voided. The law states in relevant part:
“No warrantor of a consumer product may condition his written or implied warranty of such product on the consumers using, in connection with such product, any article or service (other than article or service provided without charge under the terms of the warranty) which is identified by brand, trade or corporate name....” (15 U.S.C. 2302(C)).[HR][/HR]​
...from SEMA http://www.sema.org/warranty/atta.cfm

[Modified by JettaRed, 5:17 PM 2-11-2002]


[Modified by JettaRed, 5:18 PM 2-11-2002]
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Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (VarLordahl)

Var that wasnt needed. I guess I wont ask anymore questions here with responces like that. Other than that thank you for what responces I got.
Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (2002GTIVR6)

You can look here for an explanation.
http://www.sema.org/warranty/atta.cfm
quote:[HR][/HR]1.The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act (15 U.S.C. 2302(C))
This federal law regulates warranties for the protection of consumers. The essence of
this law concerning aftermarket auto parts is that a vehicle manufacturer may not
condition a written or implied warranty on the consumers using parts or services
which are identified by brand, trade, or corporate name (such as the vehicle makers
brand) unless the parts or service are provided free of charge. The law means that the
use of an aftermarket part alone is not cause for denying the warranty. However, the
law's protection does not extend to aftermarket parts in situations where such parts
actually caused the damage being claimed under the warranty. Further, consumers
are advised to be aware of any specific terms or conditions stated in the warranty
which may result in its being voided. The law states in relevant part:
“No warrantor of a consumer product may condition his written or
implied warranty of such product on the consumers using, in
connection with such product, any article or service (other than article
or service provided without charge under the terms of the warranty)
which is identified by brand, trade or corporate name....” (15 U.S.C.
2302(C)).[HR][/HR]​
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Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (2002GTIVR6)

I don't know all the details of chips, but i think i have a pretty good idea, at least for my engine (TDI). The chip doesn't change "everything". It primarily just changes the data maps for boost, fueling and timing. I don't know what your background is like, but I know a lot of the people around here work with computers and software... it's like keeping the code for your program the same, but just adjusting some of the data it uses slightly. The program itself is the same though for the most part... unless the tuner does something like remove/adjust the rev limiter or play with the lag/dampening for the drive-by-wire systems.
Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (TDI Vroom)

just get a chip.
Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (truckasaurus)

quote:[HR][/HR]Just ask your dealer if he ever heard of Magnassun vs. Moss. It's some landmark case that says a dealer must prove a direct relationship between your aftermarket part and whatever the problem is that they try to deny warranty service for.
Anyway, that's what someone here on the Vortex said so take it for what it's worth.
I knew my State and Local Gov't class would come in handy eventually!!!
[HR][/HR]​
Actually, I could easily make a case that a chip could affect every single part on the car! It increases power. Right? That translates to more pressure in hoses, etc and more stress on the frame. I could even make a sound argument that the increased stress on the frame results in rattles.
I knew someday Law School would come in handy!!! BTW I had a prof in Law School who actually told us to "make sure to only use our powers of argument for good!"
Here are the Cliff notes: Chip = Voided Warranty
Any work you get covered is just the dealer/VWoA being nice.
Nothing in this posting is intended to serve as legal advice. Legal advice can be obtained regarding your particular situation form representation of your choice. I may not be licensed to practice in your jurisdiction.
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Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (2002GTIVR6)

I'm trying to figure this one out for myself so here's my idea.
I've got a few good mechanics lined up just incase something goes wrong and it could possibly be attributed to the chip. I can take it in to the stealership and see if they'll take care of it. If they say anything about the chip, I'll just b*tch and moan that they're trying to make stuff up, then I'll run to my mechanic friends and have them take care of it.
I'm bound to get a few freebies out of this: window regulator, environmental controls, etc. But I'll have to pay for the engine repairs in a worst case scenario.
I figure, the value of having the chip pays for itself in the long run, so I might as well pay for the repairs when necessay...
whachytink? good idea, bad idea?
Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (Gremlin)

The only way a dealer can tell if you have a chip is to remove the ECU and look inside it. The VAG has no way of detecting it.
Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (Cosmic VR6)

I thought about a chip (and still do at times) for my VR6, but I figured $300-$600 for the chip plus possible warrany problems for only about 7-10hp doesn't seem very cost effective. If I had the 1.8T, now that's a different story; I would have done it already. JMO
Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (2002GTIVR6)

Go and take a look at this article. It should help you clear things up:
http://www.alternativeauto.com/waterbox/wb-archives/warranty.html
Also, read up on the Magnuson Moss Warranty Act of 1987.


[Modified by ArM4ND, 4:58 PM 2-11-2002]
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Re: What my VW dealer told me about chipping. (VarLordahl)

quote:[HR][/HR] Wow. That was the absolute dumbest thing you could have done. Now every single time you bring the car in with a problem, they will expect that you got chipped, and check for one. The only way anything can ever void a warranty is if it directly causes a problem you are having. [HR][/HR]​
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